p380 problems

[SabanNation]

took my new p380, serial # RB687x, to the range for the first time today.

i cleaned and lubed it first, but only got to put a little over a hundred rounds through it before the ranged closed.

ammo was remington PMC JHPs. i had about 2 or 3 fail to feeds, no extraction/ejection problems, and about 75 failures to go all the way into battery.

i really doubt this has anything to do with it, but when i took it apart the firs time to clean it, i noticed the recoil springs "open ends" were toward the muzzle, which made it a pain to get the guide rod back in. i flipped to open ends so they are against the recoil spring back and the full circle end is at the muzzle. this made it much easier to get the rod back in, as well as kept the spring wire ends from trying to go through the guide rod hole in the slide.


anyway ill try some different ammo tomorrow but i dont see these problems dissapearing, as it didnt seem to make much progress in the first 120 (plus i have racked the slide a few hundred times prior to shooting it).

is this a known issue? id hate to waste money on ammo trying to brake it in if its going to have to go back to kahr anyway. thanks.

[wyntrout]

The OPEN ends do go to the front. Just twist or rotate the springs as you're installing the recoil spring assembly. Sometimes the loose end will try to beat the rod through the hole... just back a bit and start again. The manual states this and we state it every chance we get. The closed end goes to the rear... the open end to the front and make sure the rear of the recoil rod is centered against the ledge on the underside of the barrel.

Wynn:)

[jocko]

the open end of the recoil spring goes towards the muzzle.....

put it back correctly and try again. I would recommend though breakingin with fmj ammo ifyou can find it. why waste good defense high priced ammo for break in, until it is running right. give it another 100+rounds before panicking.

the manual tells you to have the closed end towards the barrel lug. there is a reason for that..

sorry about that wyn, I think we hit the send button the same time.. great minds think alike-huh?

[SabanNation]

yeah when i cleaned it earlier i put the recoil spring back in the right way. ill get back to the range tomorrow and put another 1-2 hundred through it.

the ammo wasnt expensive. i typod and put pmc in but meant UMC.

its the hundred round value pack from walmart. i also got a hundred rounds of tul-ammo but i couldnt get it to cycle very well by hand, much worse than the umc even.

ill get out to the range again tomorrow and see if the recoil spring fix has any impact as well as giving the tul ammo a go.

[jocko]

break it in wth umc ammo and not that tul brand, i have never heard of that brand, so I bet it is foreign. cycling by hand isnot easy in the little 380, so dn't fault the gunor ammo ver that. Once you get realyused to hand racking it will work but that little gun is very difficult IMO to hand rack, Use the slide lock lever to load that first round as the manual so states. Hav eyou looked at the kahr tech section and looked at the kahr lube chart. It is a dandy and also the PROPPER PREPPING OF YOUR NEW KAHR. That might help some what to, certainly neither willhinder the gun.

[eklipto101]

Hold back on that Tull-ammo is Russian made and one of my .380 (TCP738) did not funtion at all with it, I know it cheap and all that but it's crap to be used on a nice fire arm....my .02 cent worth.

[jocko]

Indeed , hold way back on that ammo, now I know what eklipto101 is referring to

[MW surveyor]

^^^What they said.

[racuda]

Good luck. Mines been back twice so far...

[SabanNation]

fired another 2 hundred today for a total of 300.

the recoil spring was back in the right way but that didnt have any affect on function.

it just doesnt like to go all the way into battery. also, the slide locked back a few times with ammo still in the mag. this didnt happen at all yesterday.

i guess ill try some hot rounds followed by some more fmj target loads but im not wasting much more money on ammo if i have to send it back just to have to buy more ammo to run through it again.

[jocko]

sounds like rounds might be hitting the inside of the slide lock lever causing pre mature slide locking open, also if that is happening even in the slightrest, It can effect feeding,as the bullet is being thrown off course somewhat. U might want to refer to the kahr tech section and hit on the propper prepping of yor new kahr, it will tell u how to check to see if that is happening. Thumb hitting the slide stop and not knowing it is another way to have this happen and rounds hittingon the inside the other reason. I would not waste alot more money on ammo either, but I would check this possability out and if it is hitting that lever, a call to kahr and they will send you a new one pronto. If your shooting good american brand fmj ammo, and it is not working I would not waste good money with the hp ammo as it ain't gonna help any an besides that it should shoot um both as well..

[Kamuna2003@yahoo.com]

Have Kahr send you new recoil springs to help with failure to go into battery. then take off the slide and reinsert release pin and insert a loaded magazine slowly to see if bullets are hitting release pin in anyway. If it is then get a fine file and slightly file on protrusion that touches bullets just enough to clear the bullets. This should do it. I did this to my 380 and it is flawless now. You can also call kahr about it and they will send you a new realease pin. Might or might not work though. good luck buddy

[Kamuna2003@yahoo.com]

Word of caution. do not reinstall the slide with the release pin inserted into the frame. Make sure to removed the release pin first. TRUST ME. You will get a headache trying to get the slide off again. But just incase you do make that mistake just shoot me an email and I will let you know how to get it off again.

[jocko]

duh???

[BuckeyeBlast]

duh???

yeah


Regarding the springs... I thought on the P380 the larger spring had the open end towards the muzzle and the smaller spring had the open end towards the breech... No? :confused:

[TheTman]

I was having the same problems with the gun going back into battery after firing.
I had a couple others shoot it they had no problems, then talked to the range master. He said I was probably limp wristing it, and that polymer guns are much more likely to show problems with your grip than a metal framed pistol because they flex a little. I changed my grip, putting my wrist more inline with the grip, and the problem went away. I've been shooting pistols for 40 years, and never had any problems before, so I never knew I had a problem to correct. But a minor change in my grip made all the difference in the world. I was holding the gun in front of me so it looked like the letter A from above, now it's more of a right triangle, with my shooting arm held pretty straight. Wish they called it something other than limp wristing, kind of makes me feel like I otta be prancing around in a skirt or something, LOL

[jocko]

yeah


Regarding the springs... I thought on the P380 the larger spring had the open end towards the muzzle and the smaller spring had the open end towards the breech... No? :confused:

ur dead right,

[jocko]

the thing is thetmanski, back 40 years ago we never had polymer ultra ultra small guns like we hav etoday. It is a whole new learning thing for even those who like you have owned and shot all these year.

I can remember a kel tec tech, statingonce on the kt forum that over 50% of allthere guns sent backin for issues are shooter issues and not the guns. I like most who has been around guns all my life, hate to admit that just maybe it could be me and not the gun. I have always stressed that if one is having gun issues tolet a good shooter also try it out, and if he can reproduce the same thing, indeed it is the gun, if he has no issues then you yourself know where the problem is to. One has to eliminate the possables when a gun gives issues and one possable could be shooter error. Eliminate that , and then move on to what cold possably be another issue. Most here when they askif one cold be possably limping a gun, mean no offense either, as u well stated just because you have shot for 40 years doesn't mean it cannot be u either. I do agree the word limping kinda has a impotent conotation, especially when you my age and u read that wording, kinda makes me cringe. Maybe weak wristing could be a better term for it to. Weak wristing/limpwristing means the same but certainly doesn't sound the same..

[racuda]

yeah


Regarding the springs... I thought on the P380 the larger spring had the open end towards the muzzle and the smaller spring had the open end towards the breech... No? :confused:


No, both open ends go toward the muzzle.

[jocko]

racuda is right. I posted this on another thread to. but the inner spring on the P380 has been upgraded to a stronger inner spring, so if one is possably having any FTRB type issues, just order the complete set of new springs and give um a try.

[mad1ben2]

racuda is right. I posted this on another thread to. but the inner spring on the P380 has been upgraded to a stronger inner spring, so if one is possably having any FTRB type issues, just order the complete set of new springs and give um a try.


Jocko is right (as usual)... I sent my P380 back for a couple reasons... one was the FTRB. Kahr called me yesterday and told me they replaced the recoil spring (they didn't specify inner or outer) with a stronger one.

Obviously I haven't gotten it back yet...

[wyntrout]

Have Kahr send you new recoil springs to help with failure to go into battery. then take off the slide and reinsert release pin and insert a loaded magazine slowly to see if bullets are hitting release pin in anyway. If it is then get a fine file and slightly file on protrusion that touches bullets just enough to clear the bullets. This should do it. I did this to my 380 and it is flawless now. You can also call kahr about it and they will send you a new realease pin. Might or might not work though. good luck buddy

Try pushing the top cartridge slowly forward and see if it contacts the slide lock. The rounds in Kahr mags seem to get pulled forward a bit, especially the 9mm's. If the rounds were held in place by a better magazine design, a lot of these problems wouldn't occur.
The area above of the magazine is very busy in the firing and cycling phases, and sometimes the top cartridge is out of position and strikes that slide lock actuator.

Wynn:)

[jocko]

Jocko is right (as usual)... I sent my P380 back for a couple reasons... one was the FTRB. Kahr called me yesterday and told me they replaced the recoil spring (they didn't specify inner or outer) with a stronger one.

Obviously I haven't gotten it back yet...

u get it back treat it like a new gun give it the proper lube and propper pre-prep and then shoot fmj to see how it does. document what ammo ur shooting and if issues arrive at what round count. If issues arise, let another good shoter also try the gun to see if they can duplicate. When one has issues, he needs to eliminate the possables, such a maybe weak wristing the gun, ( I avoid the word limpwristing, as that sound slike a male disfunction), possable ammo related issues, gun put back together correctly, slide stop not being an issue. Keep good documented records so if by chance it has to go backyou can provide kahr with exactly what you have done to make it right. Sometimes these techs get guns sent back and not much mentioned as to how or why even, so they have to start from scratch. Good records saves tme for sure and usualy directs them right to the area of concern.

Your gun shouldbe good togowhen it gets back, ...we willbe awaiting ur report:popcorn:

[Jimmers]

Thought I would through my 2 cents in here.

I bought my new P380 just last month (this is my first Kahr). First time to the range was not a pleasant experiance. I had several failure to go fully into battery issues. About every other round was FTRB. I gave up after 50 rounds. Decided to take it home and give it a good cleaning, as I had taken it to the range straight from the gun store. I figured right out of the box it should have been ok, but guess I was mistaken. I was also using the cheapest reloaded ammo I could buy, so that may have been part of the problem.

Next day at the range was much better. I shot 200 rounds through it with not a single FTRB. I was using better ammo this time too. WWB and American Eagle. The only problem with the gun this time was the slide lock would catch the slide about every 3-4 shots. Called Kahr the next day, explained the problem, amd they sent me a new slide lock spring at no charge. Got the new spring put in about four days later and went back to the range. I ran another 200 rounds through it without a single problem.

I have since put another 300 rounds through it without any problems. Also ran a box of Remmington Golden Saber through it just fine. Feeling much better about the reliability of this gun now. Love the way it shoots.

[MikeyKahr]

Thought I would through my 2 cents in here.

I bought my new P380 just last month (this is my first Kahr). First time to the range was not a pleasant experiance. I had several failure to go fully into battery issues. About every other round was FTRB. I gave up after 50 rounds. Decided to take it home and give it a good cleaning, as I had taken it to the range straight from the gun store. I figured right out of the box it should have been ok, but guess I was mistaken. I was also using the cheapest reloaded ammo I could buy, so that may have been part of the problem.

Next day at the range was much better. I shot 200 rounds through it with not a single FTRB. I was using better ammo this time too. WWB and American Eagle. The only problem with the gun this time was the slide lock would catch the slide about every 3-4 shots. Called Kahr the next day, explained the problem, amd they sent me a new slide lock spring at no charge. Got the new spring put in about four days later and went back to the range. I ran another 200 rounds through it without a single problem.

I have since put another 300 rounds through it without any problems. Also ran a box of Remmington Golden Saber through it just fine. Feeling much better about the reliability of this gun now. Love the way it shoots.

Way to hang in there and I'm glad to hear the problems have stopped and you're feeling good about the reliability. And welcome to Kahrtalk! In case you haven't come across it yet, I suggest heading over to the Kahr Tech section and take a look through the Lube Chart thread and the Proper Prep of a Kaht thread - lots of good info there that I think would be of benefit to you and your P380.

[jocko]

Just amazing what a couple hundred rounds down range will do for a new gun. My Para carry nine gave me fits and when I talked to Para, the basically said call them back after 500 rounds. the issues went away before that. I was impatient, the gun was not ready out of the box as I thought it should be.

Kahr is one of the few companies that AT LEAST tells the owner to give it 200 rounds before panicking about issues. I know everyone , myself included feels a gun should be good to go out of the box and I do feel 90% are that way but it is the 10% that we hear on on these gun forums, and although some do need to go back for serious reliablility issues, I do think most will shoot themselves into reliability within 200 rounds. The little P380 is just one small ass gun and a shooter and the gun IMO have to mate up to be right. The gun could be right but the shooter is not right, or vice versa. So a 200 round break in is needed for both gun and shooter.... Glad to see it worked out ok. That P380 is the most accurate 380 I have ever shot, It amazes me every time I shoot it..

[mad1ben2]

u get it back treat it like a new gun give it the proper lube and propper pre-prep and then shoot fmj to see how it does. document what ammo ur shooting and if issues arrive at what round count. If issues arise, let another good shoter also try the gun to see if they can duplicate. When one has issues, he needs to eliminate the possables, such a maybe weak wristing the gun, ( I avoid the word limpwristing, as that sound slike a male disfunction), possable ammo related issues, gun put back together correctly, slide stop not being an issue. Keep good documented records so if by chance it has to go backyou can provide kahr with exactly what you have done to make it right. Sometimes these techs get guns sent back and not much mentioned as to how or why even, so they have to start from scratch. Good records saves tme for sure and usualy directs them right to the area of concern.

Your gun shouldbe good togowhen it gets back, ...we willbe awaiting ur report:popcorn:

Will do the same with the PM45... as they replaced the slide, frame and mags (broken)... they said they kept many of the internals but had to replace frame and slide. This WILL be just like a new gun... I'm not sure a new recoil spring on the P380 really qualifies it for treating it like a new gun, but I'll do so anyway and keep good records just in case. I've already picked up 200 rounds of WWB for the P380 and have plenty of Blazer for the PM45.

[racuda]

Kahr replaced many parts on my P380 after two trips back including the frame, extractor, striker block, cocking cam and recoil spring. I was expecting have to treat it like a new gun, with the associated FTF's and FTE's. So far I have had zero malfunctions. So it goes to show they CAN and WILL eventually make it right.

[jocko]

Kahr replaced many parts on my P380 after two trips back including the frame, extractor, striker block, cocking cam and recoil spring. I was expecting have to treat it like a new gun, with the associated FTF's and FTE's. So far I have had zero malfunctions. So it goes to show they CAN and WILL eventually make it right.

unfortunalty we don't have the priveledge of trial and error like Kahr does and basically this is what they did. They more than likely can't tell if it is a slide/or frame issue, but they can eliminate either buy trying another of each .

We just don'thave that option.

I stated a couple of times my P380 was running like a track star and at around 1200 rounds it stopped locking open with either of my magazines. I trie4d new mag springs, no luck new mag followers, no luck new slide stop release, no luck, new mag catch, no luck, gun went bang every time but just would not lock open. Sent it back with the magazines andit came back with a new slide, and it worked perfect after that. Now #1, what the hell changed in 1200 rounds to cause this. #2. how would anyone ever trouble shoot that issue if they didn't have a slew of new parts in front of them to test and retest out. I love this litlte P380 but I can't say it has been issue free. I feel it is now though, so I am cool with it and kudos to kahr also.:israel: