First Kahr and first post on KahrTalk

[Willieboy]

Bought a new PM9 the other day and took it to the range today to see how it would perform. In two hundred rounds, I had four FTF, all with the seven round magazine. In one instance, the slide failed to lock back after firing the last round. I think this also took place using the seven round magazine.

I had not been shooting in quite some time, maybe two years, and the rust was evident. It took until the last fifty rounds for my nerves to settle and I was able to begin grouping in the target's center mass.

Normally, I shoot a G26 or a KelTec P11. I shoot both these guns well and I think I can do well with the Kahr , given more range time.

What prompted me to try a Kahr was the desire for a single stack 9 on which I could rely to function reliably. I am part of my church's informal security team and needed to find something I could easily conceal in a shirt-tucker. I think the Kahr will fill that bill better than the Glock or double stack P11. The gun and I just need to get to know each other.

Thanks for reading.

Bill

[wyntrout]

I don't know what it is about those 7-round mags, but those seem to give everyone some trouble. I carry with the 6-round (6+1) and have the 7-rounder for a spare, realizing it might give me some trouble on the second or third shot when the round that was pulled forward a bit takes a dive... danged 9mm cartridges just can't stay still in the Kahr mags.

Wynn:)

[Bawanna]

Informal security team for a church.:eek: You must be in some kind of rough neighborhood dude.

At least your among friends here on Kahrtalk and hope you stick around and hang out with us. We got members down your direction that I'm sure will act as the cavalry if the need arises.

As Oneshot (is it Oneshot?) says Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition.


Welcome.

[wyntrout]

That's a great idea and better than praying for no trouble. I've always heard that the Lord helps those who help themselves.
Churches aren't exempt from criminal activities... or crazies.

Wynn:)

[Willieboy]

Thanks for your replies guys.

Bawanna, church security teams are not as uncommon as you might think, though I surprised to hear our church had one. What motivated me to join is that one of the team members is a retired policeman. His son is also a police officer who has some anti-terror involvement. I don't remember if he is part of a federal taskforce, but I think that is the case. He came to the church and spoke to team members about things going on in the U.S. about which the public knows nothing. He said Christian churches have been (are being) attacked by Islamists who are targeting the young girls (virgins of acceptable age per the Koran) in the congregation.

It seems to me, however unlikely such an attack may be, a little planning and preparation is a small price to pay to guard against such an event.

[joshh]

cant believe i am the 1st to say this but, go to the tech section and follow the cleaning and break in procedure. then shoot, rinse repeat! these pm9's are sweet little pistols that are really surprisingly fun to shoot. that many ftf's isnt normal. ive shot a lot thru mine & have had 0 ftf's or stovepipes. what ammo were you shooting?

[eastenn]

Church security isn't unheard of in TN either. I think the likelihood of a church shooting is only second to a school shooting.

I have actually been within 2 miles of two shootings. The first was in 2002 I was in high school just down the road from the Appalachian School of Law shooting. The second I was off campus at my apartment during the Virginia Tech massacre.

[Willieboy]

Thanks for the tip Joshh. I was shooting 115 grain Blazer aluminum cases.

I sure hope there is never any trouble in our church Eastenn but, apparently the elders take the threat of these attacks seriously. Helping out seemed like the least I could do to protect the sheep from the wolves.

I think you're right Wyntrout about helping ourselves. Personally, if I were looking to attack a church, I'd look somewhere other than south Texas.

[mad1ben2]

if I were looking to attack a church, I'd look somewhere other than south Texas.

:) Have to agree with you on that one! ;)

Welcome and enjoy that new PM9... one heck of an awesome pistol!

[Tat2dman]

I sent a 7 rounder back to Kahr,with a request for a new 6 rounder,it arrived back in 6 days!Way to listen!Figured I`d get a 7 but all`s well now!

[Willieboy]

Good to know Barry. I think I'll give that a try.

It seems from reading these forums, the problems with the seven round magazines have been around for quite awhile. I wonder why Kahr hasn't fixed it yet. I also wonder of those who buy Kahrs intended to use seven round magazines experience unreliable feeding. Just seems this magazine problem should not be insurmountable.

[Lobo_79]

cant believe i am the 1st to say this but, go to the tech section and follow the cleaning and break in procedure...

Great advice for sure. If I've learned anything about my PM9 it's that the owner's manual and the tech forum contain some essential information that should not be ignored. The lube chart is especially useful. So much so that I printed and laminated a copy of it to keep by my cleaning bench. I always use the recommended procedure for chambering the first round, and call me excessive compulsive, but I also clean my magazines after each range visit.

My PM9 has about 1600 rounds through it now. I'm not exactly melting down the barrel by shooting it but I also had a problem with the 7-round magazine. Kahr replaced it for me and the new mag has been flawless so far.

[jocko]

I have always felt the 7 round magazine issues on the PM series kahrs is more of an issue than on the cw or P or K series guns. My thoughts are that everyone shoots differently, example like some grip differently than others and this extended magazine gives us another place of that lone finger that before had nothing to hold on to. Now we are pushing,pulling do something with that extended magazine that is somehow distorting it to relatively being correct in the grip like the flush fit magazines is, which we can't screw up with any awkward pressure on the magazine as we can really touch that flush magazine. So some guns work fine and some don't and I think it is due to different pressures on that extended magazine. Should they all work, certainly they should but with some shooters they don't. Sometimes a new magazine solves the issues, sometimes just a waste of time and postage IMO. I wish kahr wou ld drop the damn 7 rounder in ther pM series and just issue another flush fit magazine, as that is what we basically bought the small gun for. If I wanted a longer grip feel. I would buy a P seriers or the cw series. but thats just me and my thoughts..

[Willieboy]

I agree Jocko, that two six rounders would be better. Would also be safer for the shooter and possibly Kahr. IMO, they should not include a magazine with known problems, even if it is the shooter who causes the problem.

What you said about seven round magazine in pistols intended to accomodate them versus the PM series would seem to lend credence to your hypothesis about the shooter's role in causing the problem. Those shooting the other models cannot apply any twisting or torque to the magazine.

That said, Glock sure does not have any issues using longer magazines in their G26....and those mags are made of plastic. Go figure.

[Bawanna]

Metal lined plastic but plastic none the less.

[Willieboy]

You are correct sir.

[jocko]

no argument from me on the magazine thing, just my 2 cents anyways. They should work, most all do work as planned, those that don't if one works at ti , he can get it going right. I just always thought also that extened 7 rounder in my PM9 had to be the world most butt ugly magazine also. Almost like they ran out of plastic for the mag butt plate and someone said, aw hell produce it ,,, those kahr people have no brains anyhow or they would be shooting glocks.

got that off of a glock forum!!!!!

[Bawanna]

I never could get a grasp on our obsession with dumping magazines. The europeans don't like the metal lining. They want the magazine to bulge when its partially full. When they go to eject a magazine and it won't go, they know they have bullets left. When its low or empty it will pop out.
We want that bad boy to jump out of the gun empty or full. Different trains of thought apparently.

[jocko]

never thought of it that way Bawanna, u are one smart dude or is that dud. anyway, did not at one time glock mags were made all of plastic???

Gotta give those euro guys some credit. they make nice cars. The french as u well know really never cared one way or the other about dumping magazines etc. Those ba-tards dropped the entire guns. That was part of their training, seeing how fast they can drop their guns and grab in their rear pocket for the french flag, which is also the universal color for I GIVE UP, DON'T SHOOT.. The french call that color today yet, SURRENDER WHITE. Yup been over there in the past years and they still don't take lightley to dropping things. I was in a shop buying something in France and I accidently dropped my cell phone and when they heard that noise they all raised their hands. Just can't teach old dogs new tricks..

I have a fine collection of French War rifles. The add said when I bought them. French war rifles, never fired, dropped once!! Nice guns..

[Bawanna]

All of the Glock mags that aren't imported to us are still all plastic. That's the way they were designed and that's the way they like them over there. You rarely see any all plastic ones over here, not sure a person could even get one.

Seems like I saw a few years ago and of course the guy was whining cause his mags wouldn't fly across the room when he hit the eject button. Maybe some slipped thru by accident or perhaps very early ones before metal lining.

[joshh]

i didnt realize there were that many who had issues w/ the 7rnd mags. i like to carry the 7 rounder as a spare. i bought some kydex and a piece of leather to make a mag holster but i have been throwing it in the small pocket in my jeans when i carry it. it sticks up a little but even if most people saw it they wouldnt know what it was. only issue i have is the 7rnd wont drop free.