New PM9 Issues

[ricklee4570]

Yesterday I inspected my new PM9 in preparation for todays range session. I did the break in routine recommended here. When I did magazine check (removed magazine spring and checked to make sure the follower didn't hang up on the magazine release). Both followers hung up on the mag. release so I did the recommended work on the follower using some sandpaper. I got both magazines where they cleared the release.

Went to the range today. The 6 round magazine worked perfect. I shot 100 rounds of WWB 115 fmj. The 7 round magazine jammed every time. The bullets were nose diving within the first shot or two. I contoured both followers exactly the same, so I'm not to sure why it wouldn't function....so I just chalked it up to a bad magazine.

Then I opened a box of Speer Gold Dot 124 +P JHP Short Barrel ammo. I couldn't get through one magazine without the slide prematurely locking back. That was disappointing as the Gold Dots were very accurate.

I am going to file the slide stop notch that contacts the magazine follower. Hopefully I can find that sweet spot that allows the proper function of the slide stop while still allowing the Gold Dots to cycle.

My friend was with me shooting his LC9 and I got to hear about how my $700.00 gun needs all this additional work!

I really like this Kahr. Hopefully I will get it to run 100% reliably.

[O'Dell]

Some of the 7 rounders are problematic. My PM9 came with three 6 rounders and one seven although I didn't ask for it. It makes a very concealable pistol less concealable, so I gave it away without even trying it. I've heard on the forum that Kahr will trade a 6 for a 7.

My gun shoots standard GD's w/o issue although I prefer HST's. Are the +p short barrel rounds longer by chance, and can they be making contact with the slide stop.

[ricklee4570]

The Gold Dot hollowpoint is wider. The WWB is a smaller and shorter round.

For the price I paid for this gun I shouldn't have to make all these modifications. A less experienced and less mechanical person would probably be sending this gun back to Kahr.

In a worst case scenario I will remove the lock back tab that the magazine follower contacts. In that case I will have to manually lock the slide back when needed. It would not automatically lock the slide back when I run the magazine empty. The most important thing is that the gun is reliable. If I have to trust my life with it, I can't risk a malfunction.

[OldLincoln]

Sorry you're having the slide lock issue, Rick. You are still in the early stages and your PM being new needs more round nose to break in before you even try carry ammo. I hope you don't intend to carry it before it is ready. I really suggest that you shoot a few hundred round nose through it before coming back to the Gold Dots. Many have had issues at first but they went away soon.

I wouldn't recommend disabling the lock back tab, but instead after more break in just tweak it a bit. I will likely come around and you will feel a lot better about it.

[harrydog]

Not trying to hijack this thread but I'm having the same problem.
Yesterday I took my new PM9 to the range for the first time and ran 140 rounds through it. 50 rounds each of Blazer and Federal FMJ - no problems. Also no problems with 25 Remington Golden Sabers. But 3 times the slide locked back prematurely with 124 gr Gold Dots.
I've never had this type of malfunction in a pistol before. Is it a magazine problem? Unfortunately I don't remember if all the malfunctions were with the 7 round mag or not but I do know at least one of them was.
I'm not going to get too worried until I'm sure it's well broken in but if the 7 round magazines are the issue, it's an easy fix since I prefer the 6 rounders with this gun anyway.
I really like this gun though, so I hope I can get it worked out.
Also, where can I get information on tweaking the lock-back tab?

[Bill K]

With my PM9 had 7 rounder mag problems. Kahr exchanged 7 rounder for a six rounder. Had no premature slide lock problems until after finishing up with my 115 ball break-in ammo but problem arose when testing with my Black Hills 124 +P SD ammo. Honed slide lock lever down ever so much and issue was resolved.

[mightymouse]

Its here in the forums, but here's what I did to my CM9 since Gold Dot 124 +P was (is) going to be my carry ammo. This is how I contoured mine, rounding and polishing,YMMV, and the after picture using Gold Dots 124 gr. I had severe contact with the bullet nose causing premature slide lock, but now clears fine and 100% reliable.
Some where I heard Kahr tests their guns with 124, but I'm wondering with what brand now. Shameful that they can't handle one of the most popular defense rounds.
Chalk another up to DIY owner making the Kahr a reliable carry gun.
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g22/BowtiedZ/slidelock_1.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g22/BowtiedZ/slidelock_2.jpg

[Southpaw]

My new PM9 also had the same premature slide lock issue after break-in, using Gold Dot 124's. After doing some googling, I found the fix (strangely enough, posted on the kel-tec owners group site). This link (http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1288721185) has some good photos of the PM9 that illustrate why it happens - has to do with the wider taper of the nose of the Gold Dot round. A little light work with a file on the inside face of the slide lock lever and the problem was fixed. I've shot more than 100 rounds of Gold Dot 124's through my PM9 and haven't experienced any more premature slide lock, gun performs flawlessly now.

[ricklee4570]

Mightymouse, it looks like you removed quite a bit of metal. Is there enough metal left to reliably lock the slide open after the last round has been fired?

If you insert an empty magazine with the slide closed and then hit the magazine release, does it eject the magazine or hang up?

Im still puzzled as to why so many people seem to have problems with the 7 round magazines.

[jocko]

My P380 would not shoot 102 golden sabres withhout hitting the slide lock lever. What MM and southpaw did was what most good smitty's would have also done, so kudos to doing it yourself. No doubt this forum and others to have passed on this info and how to fix the issue. I had to have 3 slide lock lever sent to me my Para for my carry 9 before it got right..

what would have kahr done if u sent it back? Just replaced with a new slide lock lever and test fired, if it still did it, they would continue until they got one that worked in the gun OR they might even do what most good smitty's would have done, modifed the existing lever and be done with it. Either way if it works then don't fix it.

[mightymouse]

Mightymouse, it looks like you removed quite a bit of metal. Is there enough metal left to reliably lock the slide open after the last round has been fired?

If you insert an empty magazine with the slide closed and then hit the magazine release, does it eject the magazine or hang up?

Im still puzzled as to why so many people seem to have problems with the 7 round magazines.
My modification works perfectly, but as with everything you see on the internet do at your own risk. If and when the Gold Dot round shifts forward slightly, it actually still makes contact. That's why I gave it a rounded couture.
My practice rounds are WWB 115 gr and carry 124s. All work 100% now, always locks after last round.
If you screw up, another slide stop is basically peanuts from Kahr.
If really in doubt of one's abilities, or just don't want to risk. I'd advise shipping back to Kahr and tell them which round is giving you the hang up.
I left a lot of material underneath for the magazine to catch.
My mags drop after a touch of work to them. One was fine, the other a tad tight. Not sure the relevance of that to the slide stop.

[ricklee4570]

Thanks, looks like you have yours running right.

Im done with mine now, so later next week I will take it to the range and test it.

[mightymouse]

One more quick image. This is with the round 2 124 gr gold dot coming up which always sees to be a bit advanced in the magazine (see gap between back of round and mag) It actually just grazes the Gold Dot, but slides nicely around and doesn't activate the slide stop.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g22/BowtiedZ/CM9-124_plusP_GD.png

Mag empty and slide stop lever engaged:
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g22/BowtiedZ/CM9-124_plusP_GD1.png

[ricklee4570]

Awesome pics. Thanks!

I might have removed a tad bit too much metal. Only way to know for sure is to fire it. I will take it to the range later this week and see.

The reason I may have removed to much: I loaded it with Gold Dots and with the slide off there is sufficient clearance now. I hand cycled it and it loaded and ejected fine and the slide locked open after the last round was manually ejected.

Before I altered the slide stop lever, upon pressing the magazine release button, the magazine smartly popped right out under the magazine spring pressure. However, now, if I load an empty magazine with the slide closed and rack the slide, it does not lock open. As a matter of fact, the magazine wont drop free either when the magazine release button is pressed. What is happening is that the magazine follower (the area that contacts the slide release--or lock in this case) moves just enough and the part I altered is smaller and highly polished so that the follower slips to the side of the slide release and wedges in there not pushing up on the slide release to lock the slide back, but instead resting next to it. Hope I explained that right!

As stated though, when loading a full magazine, it appears to function right when cycling by hand and does lock the slide back. It only wedges in there when loading an empty magazine and racking the slide.

That may not be a problem at all. Like I stated earlier, I love this pistol, and if I need it to function 100% reliably. If that means altering it to where the slide does not lock back on the last round, I can live with that. I cant live with premature slide lock backs.

[jocko]

If u can find a more informative forum around let me know. These guys know their stuff and some are soo good with the camera stuff that words are not needed.

Guarantee u , if u have a question or problem, this forum has the solution. Most have been through it..

[mightymouse]

Awesome pics. Thanks!

I might have removed a tad bit too much metal. Only way to know for sure is to fire it. I will take it to the range later this week and see.

The reason I may have removed to much: I loaded it with Gold Dots and with the slide off there is sufficient clearance now. I hand cycled it and it loaded and ejected fine and the slide locked open after the last round was manually ejected.

Before I altered the slide stop lever, upon pressing the magazine release button, the magazine smartly popped right out under the magazine spring pressure. However, now, if I load an empty magazine with the slide closed and rack the slide, it does not lock open. As a matter of fact, the magazine wont drop free either when the magazine release button is pressed. What is happening is that the magazine follower (the area that contacts the slide release--or lock in this case) moves just enough and the part I altered is smaller and highly polished so that the follower slips to the side of the slide release and wedges in there not pushing up on the slide release to lock the slide back, but instead resting next to it. Hope I explained that right!

As stated though, when loading a full magazine, it appears to function right when cycling by hand and does lock the slide back. It only wedges in there when loading an empty magazine and racking the slide.

That may not be a problem at all. Like I stated earlier, I love this pistol, and if I need it to function 100% reliably. If that means altering it to where the slide does not lock back on the last round, I can live with that. I cant live with premature slide lock backs.
If I'm reading this right, perhaps too much material was removed ?? I know mine will still lock back with empty mag and after last shot. No wedgies so far like you described. For all I know I could have left much more metal than I did and still have it function 100%. Another slide stop lever might be in order. I haven't been able to find the MIM, metal injection molded unit (CM9) on Kahr's part list, but I'd think it a cheaper alternative to the machined PM9 piece. Who knows, a new one might cycle fine with no mods. I know If you call Kahr customer service and mention the premature slide lock, at least in the past they would just send you a new one.

[jocko]

I think the MIM and PM9 forged slide stops are the same price, either will fit, I think the cw series will also fit..

[ricklee4570]

Update:

I went out yesterday.

100 rounds of WWB=100% reliability

20 rounds of Speer Gold Dot=100% reliability

50 rounds of Hornady Critical Defense=100% reliability

I then shot a hodge podge of misc. extra ammo I had laying around, 100% reliability.

Right before leaving the range I tried the 7 round magazine again and experienced the nose dives again. Im giving up on the 7 rounder!

I ordered two more 6 round mags from Cheaper than Dirt and will make the slight follower modification when I recieve them and they should be good to go.

I really like this little gun. I couldnt tell much difference in recoil between any of the rounds, even the +P loads. Very managable!

[JimBianchi]

My MK9 also had issues with 7 and 8rd mags, but only under specific circumstances. They make great range mags, but I only carry 6rd mags for CCW.

[bamaman]

I had to do the same thing with my CW9 so it would feed the gold dots. Worked like a charm. Great info on this site.