10 mm handguns

[Dietrich]

Hello my friends.I am not at all familiar with the 10mm round but I know many of you are.How does it compare in knockdown power with other calibers? Are 10mm handguns generally reliable? I just don`t hear that much about this round and I was wondering how it has been received by the general public and law enforcement.

[melissa5]

Hello my friends.I am not at all familiar with the 10mm round but I know many of you are.How does it compare in knockdown power with other calibers? Are 10mm handguns generally reliable? I just don`t hear that much about this round and I was wondering how it has been received by the general public and law enforcement.

I have no idea about the knockdown power, but I think you can use a 10mm conversion barrel in your new G30SF. :)

[jocko]

they say it is a handfull, not popular at all but those that shoot um love um. Just a round that never made the grade. Ammo not cheap by any means..Alot of knock down power.

[CJB]

Here comes another "been there done that" CB story...

~~~ The backstory:
I got sick one time with the flu really bad. My friend, the late "Handy Andy" suggested I build a gun to pass the time while sick. So we talked about it a bit, and I decided update one of my 1911's with a 45/.38 Clerke barrel from BarSto. I called Irv Stone, and he said "no way CB!". He had other plans for me. He just finished a batch of 10mm prototype barrels for "a new Colt pistol", and like always, he made a few extras. So we talked a bit, and I got a barrel from him. This was about... maybe four or five months before the Delta Elite was announced. The idea was to open up the breechface of a .38 Super I had (and didn't care for). But what about magazines? Irv said that the Wilson Combat .45 magazine worked pretty well with no alteration - and thats what they used over at BarSto since Colts hadn't provided them with anything other than the spec for the barrel. Ok what about ammo? Irv me 20 Norma 10mm cases, gratis. Said that Huntington would make the dies and that they also had some bullets over there as well. Huntington normally had to custom make those dies, but they happened to have an incomplete set, and said they could whack out the case flare die in a day. So it all came in, and the gun got built! I was afraid of the recoil - based on the calculation of bullet weight and velocity claim of Norma's ammo, as compared to that of a .45acp. I had no access to the fancy double spring arrangement Colt used. I also had absolutely no reloading info - so based the initial loads on 38 Super loads and Blue Dot powder. I think my first loads were more or less like 40S&W loads. By this time, I was well again, and got in some Norma "10mm Bren" factory ammo, which was expensive and 20 shots to the box. The recoil was bad. The Wilson mag didn't work with those. The slide came back so fast that the top round in the mag would be ejected along with the empty case, and the next round was stripped but fed poorly. The light loads worked just fine though. Back to the calculator, I figured out that to get the slide velocity of a 45 auto, I'd need to add just about 5-1/2 ounces of weight to the slide and/or barrel. Turns out that there was a "bushing compensator" that Wilson had (in the 80s) that weighed - 5-1/2 ounces! Put that on, and the makeshift magazines were working great with factory ammo - which I only had a few of left. The gun was a hit with the customers at the range. I ended up putting a bushing in the compensator to provide a little extra "comp" by restricting gasses a bit more. The hole was just over 45 cal, and I bushed it to just over 40 cal - and also had to make it eccentric or the bullets would graze the comp (keyholes anyone?). Eventually, Colt released the Delta Elite, and I got some of the Colt magazines, and their double spring setup. The gun worked flawlessly without the compensator's added weight. I never took out the "bridge" of metal over the slide stop. Never had an issue, it never cracked with many rounds through the gun. Maybe Colt was being cautious, dunno.
That gun is now the possession of of my good friend "Ed W", and I ended up building him a .22, 9mm/38Super, 10mm, and 45cal top ends that all worked on that frame. He's got it all in a nice foam case with all the spares (ejectors and slide stops) and magazines.

~~~ How it shot:

The 10mm is a handful. Much stouter than the 45 in the same weight gun. do the calculation on the hottest 10mm loads and you'll find its darn near a 41magnum. Use that at a yardstick to the recoil. Its not uncontrollable, but its different from the 45auto.

On the hurtin' end - the 10mm did things to jugs of water that nothing else short of a .357 would do. Jugs just exploded with real nice effect. The 45 or 9 doesn't do that the same way. Its pretty impressive. We got serious craters in the sand/clay backstop.

Dunno if it helps, but hoped the story was a ok read.

[jeepster09]

I have a Glock 20C and like it, it is not bad to shoot. Power is said to be comparable to a 41 magnum.

http://i691.photobucket.com/albums/vv276/jeepster09/IMG_0996-1.jpg

[johnh]

I am a huge 10mm fan and have owned many guns in the caliber. The round is extremely versatile when reloading. You can run everything from light loads that are softer than 40 caliber, to stuff creeping up into the .357 magnum range. That and in an auto-loader. Gun choices are narrower than in the beginning, but this good in some cases. Early on makers chambered pistols for 10mm that were not really up to the task. The down side is that we lost a really good manufacturer support base when the 40 took over.

Currently I have a C-Bob in the caliber. It is stout to shoot, but you get used to it. Feels like a warm .45 with the hotter loads. My practice loads are light, but would still be consider +p if loaded in 40. I also have one of my original Deltas that I need to have modernized. It is setup in a late-80s custom configuration that I would change much given what I have learned since. I also have a 10mm Witness Limited that is a tack driver and very easy to shoot. Then my 1026. Rare bird that one. Not sure if it will stay in my collection, but it is very easy to shoot. I likely will grab a Glock 20SF when I get a chance.

There is a lot to love in the 10mm, and I feel it is much underrated by manufacturers. I know Glock, EAA, and CZ/Dan Wesson sell all the guns they make without any trouble. Fans of the 10mm are loyal, and if a company makes the guns, they will sell.

[Barth]

Hello my friends.I am not at all familiar with the 10mm round but I know many of you are.How does it compare in knockdown power with other calibers? Are 10mm handguns generally reliable? I just don`t hear that much about this round and I was wondering how it has been received by the general public and law enforcement.

I don't want to repeat, and this is old news for the older guys,
but I can't take it LOL. so I'll make it short.
1) Knockdown Power - it's like a 41 mag
2) Reliable? That's the gun not the round - (nothing wrong a 10MM)
3) How received? Heavy recoil from full house rounds made it unpopular.

Technical Note:
Downloaded version of 10 MM (180 grain subsonic) came out of FBI tests
and eventually lead to the modern 40 cal S&W (10mm short if you will).

[Dietrich]

I have no idea about the knockdown power, but I think you can use a 10mm conversion barrel in your new G30SF. :)

The dickens you say!!The plot takes a new turn amd gets even more interesting.

[500KV]

The dickens you say!!The plot takes a new turn amd gets even more interesting.

Melissa5 is correct about the conversion.
Here's all you need to shoot 10mm.
http://www.glockmeister.com/G30_G30SF-KKM-10MM-Match-Grade-Conversion-Barrel/productinfo/G30G1/.
I didn't realize the conversion capability of the G30sf either. Don't own one (yet) but might have to start looking. :cheer2:

[Willieboy]

Hello Dietrich. I haven't read the preceding posts and hope I'm not repeating what's already been said, but here's what I remember about the 10mm when it was introduced, at the request of the FBI if I recall correctly. Colt came out with their 1911 in 10mm and I think it was called the Delta Elite. Smith and Wesson came out with a 10mm version of their 3rd generation 4506 model. The relevant thing I seem to remember is the 10mm was very hard on both guns. I think the .40 was developed to replace the 10mm in the hope it would provide similar performance without tearing up the guns that shot them.

[jocko]

Melissa5 is correct about the conversion.
Here's all you need to shoot 10mm.
http://www.glockmeister.com/G30_G30SF-KKM-10MM-Match-Grade-Conversion-Barrel/productinfo/G30G1/.
I didn't realize the conversion capability of the G30sf either. Don't own one (yet) but might have to start looking. :cheer2:

is a sharp gal, i would have never doubted her statement, as I seen the light 27 years ago. I just ordered 10# oif moon cheese based on melissa's "things to buy".:cheer2:

[earle8888]

I recollect--After a shoot out in Florida, being out-gunned with their 9MM, they tried the 10MM. That's day and night!!!! It accomplished all their desired performance goals, BUT, The recoil was tooooo much for some of its people! After load adjustments they ended up with the now 40 S&W, It's sort of like 380 to 9; 40 to 10

[500KV]

is a sharp gal, i would have never doubted her statement, as I seen the light 27 years ago. I just ordered 10# oif moon cheese based on melissa's "things to buy".:cheer2:

No,No, I didn't doubt that she was correct.
I agree, if Melissa recommended it it must be OK.
But "27 years ago" makes you a relative newly wed.
Put another 20 on that and you'll definitely see things in a different light. ;)

Back to the main subject: One could just buy the G29sf and get conversion barrels to go to .357Sig and .40S&W.
That would leave out the .45ACP option though.
Now I'm getting (more) confused. :confused:

[CJB]

The Colt Delta Elites hold up just fine. They have the bridge of metal across the slide stop area taken out. They have a polymer guide rod that must be replaced every so often. And they have stout mainsprings as well as doubled up stout recoil springs. I cant recall how the Smith's held up, but dont recall any problem other than the soft hammer issue that Smith had for a short time (hooks rounding in double action shooting).

[jocko]

500KV, witht he wife I have now that loves to ride her own Harley and shoot guns, I think I will make that 20+ years to. Life is good.

[WGSNewnan]

knockdown power = same as any other handgun. Pitiful. you want knock down power. carry a 12 gauge or .308. reliability - as good as any other .40 caliber round in any particular gun.
recoil - similar to .357 and .41 mag full power loads. reduced power loads are just like the .40 S&W. unless you intend on carrying buffalo bore or other full power loads, you would be just as well off with a .40 S&W.

[Dietrich]

is a sharp gal, i would have never doubted her statement, as I seen the light 27 years ago. I just ordered 10# oif moon cheese based on melissa's "things to buy".:cheer2:

You`re doggone right she`s sharp.If I was a single man,I`d be outside her parlor window of an evening strumming a ukulele and serenading her with romantic ditties.Then I`d escort her to the ice cream parlor for her favorite sundae.Just a guess but I`d bet on hot fudge.

[melissa5]

You`re doggone right she`s sharp.If I was a single man,I`d be outside her parlor window of an evening strumming a ukulele and serenading her with romantic ditties.Then I`d escort her to the ice cream parlor for her favorite sundae.Just a guess but I`d bet on hot fudge.

Make it a butterfinger blizzard and you've got a date! ;)

[jocko]

You`re doggone right she`s sharp.If I was a single man,I`d be outside her parlor window of an evening strumming a ukulele and serenading her with romantic ditties.Then I`d escort her to the ice cream parlor for her favorite sundae.Just a guess but I`d bet on hot fudge.

Bawanna would be on ur ass like stink on sh-t if u even tried. He p;robalby willbe pm-ing your for even thinking and saying it. He is very possessive:7:

[Dietrich]

Bawanna would be on ur ass like stink on sh-t if u even tried. He p;robalby willbe pm-ing your for even thinking and saying it. He is very possessive:7:
You`re probably right.Bawanna gets very jealous when he thinks someone is flirting with me.

[500KV]

500KV, witht he wife I have now that loves to ride her own Harley and shoot guns, I think I will make that 20+ years to. Life is good.
That combination is as near perfect as it gets.
Here's hoping you both make that 20+++.

Melissa wouldn't be safe at all if I was still single.
Every time she threw the dishwater out the door, she'd throw it right in my face.

[melissa5]

You fellas sure know how to turn a girls head! ;)

[Bawanna]

You`re probably right.Bawanna gets very jealous when he thinks someone is flirting with me.

Your darn tooting. Figured I'd be a dead man if I cut off one of our horses heads so I went down the street and got a goat head. I'll have to see if Jocko approves that.
It's in the mail to Melissa for flirting with my man.

I'm such a wierd one. You guys moving on my girl, and Deitrich too. Turn my back for 2 minutes and this is what I get.

[melissa5]

I absolutely will not accept delivery of a goat head! :32: Those are some evil looking creatures. Of course, if you would like to send a goat that I can make cheese from, that would be a different story. Or, a fainting goat would be good for amusement value. I guess they would also cut grass for me. Yes, send me a whole goat, but not an old goat! :D

[OldLincoln]

Knockdown power is pretty good according the the Hickok 45 video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MPSDjJQIv4) the 10 looks a little better than the 45 looks a little better than the 40 etc.

[Dietrich]

I absolutely will not accept delivery of a goat head! :32: Those are some evil looking creatures. Of course, if you would like to send a goat that I can make cheese from, that would be a different story. Or, a fainting goat would be good for amusement value. I guess they would also cut grass for me. Yes, send me a whole goat, but not an old goat! :D
The older the violin the sweeter the music.

[Bawanna]

I've tried goats and horses cutting the grass, ya just can't the bastards to eat in a nice straight line and they miss spots.

Old goats, young goats, all good, just no ugly goats.