P380 Problems

[Rightwing]

Well, after some initial success with my P380, I had to send it back to Kahr. I was having multiple feed and ejection problems which began occurring more frequently ironically after the 200 round break-in period. I have cleaned it, racked the slide a few hundred times etc.. But still problems. I have sent it back, but still no word on when it will be coming back and that was over 3 weeks ago. I am REALLY hoping they fix this, the P380 is the only firearm I have found that fits comfortably an unrecognized in my pocket and is still fun to take to the range to practice with. But it would be nice to have better information coming back from the company on the status of the repair and when it will be fixed. Fingers crossed that it comes back trouble free!

[jocko]

3 weeks is normally 2 weeks longer than normal for kahr.The kahr P380 is the nicest little 380 on the market WHEN THEY WORK RIGHT...

[georgepittenger]

If u jump over to the AMMO forum you'll see a recent 380ammo test by Ljutic that will at least give u 3 loads to AVOID out of about 20 .
Good luck

[Bill K]

I'm with you about the value of having a comfortable and non-printing piece in ones pocket. I'll favor my PM9 for pocket carry but there a few pants pockets where only my .380 will both fit and allow a smooth fast draw. Get your P380 up and running! I'm cheering for you.

Bill K.

[AlanS]

Data point. I sent a P380 back to Kahr for evaluation/repair on June 18th, arriving the 20th. No word on it yet.

Alan

[Rightwing]

I sent mine back overnight on the 10th, so it will be 4 weeks soon. I thought I read somewhere two to three weeks was average. This was a brand new gun with a few hundred rounds in it, so it can't be too bad.

[TominCA]

That's really slow - they must be into vacations or something - Mine are usually sent and Back!! within 8 days. You might want to send an email with your RA number on it and inquire about the status.

[Rightwing]

I have sent several emails, and have called them as well. Their response has varied, from it is in que waiting for repair, to most recently them saying they are waiting for a part. I thought that was strange since it is in their factory. I wish I could give you a more detailed description but they are not providing me with any specific info. I am really hoping it comes back OK, I don't want to go through this again! It was such a great little gun for the first 150 rounds, so I still think this effort is worth it.

[jocko]

we would probably be very surpised to find out just how "little" kahr makes for their guns. I would bet their guns are 75% vendor outsourced..

[Rightwing]

Wow Jocko, never contemplated that kahr wouldn't have the part on the P380 that needed repaired because it was outsourced. Of course I don't know what part needs repaired because all I get out of customer service through phone calls an emails is that my firearm is waiting to be repaired, they are sorry for any inconvenience, and they will let me know when it will be ready to ship. How about an explanation as to why it has been there four weeks with no end in sight!

[jocko]

no good explanation, other than possable it is a vendor part that is needed. They should rob Peter to pay Paul for your warranty repair and not hold u up IMO. Maybe a nice phone call and inquire and if u get this part stuff, then indeed ask what part and why not take one off the assembly line and get me (U) going. Kahr doesnt make the polyumer grip, they don't make the barrel (although they do the finish part on it but it comes from Lothar in pre rifle blank. They don't make the recoil springs, (wolffs does). I doubt if they make the recoil rods either. they buy the stainless in blanks and indeed do the cnc machining of the slide. I would be surprised if them make the trigger bar, certainly no sprngs in the gun are made or formed by kahr. The steel front slide rails and rear slide rails that are both inbedded in the polymer frame are vendor made. I would say any MIM part like the slide stop levers are vendor related. I would be surprised if they even machine (forge) that slide stop levers for all other models either. Magazines certainly are not made by kahr. Sights certainly not made by kahr. The grips for the steel version kahrs are certainly vendor made. WHAT IS LEFT???

That is what industry does, they design it and then go to specialty companies to make certain parts for their product. Kahr might also be using the JUST IN TIME parts inventory. One needed part made by Joe Blow could hold up an entire product..

[AlanS]

If I hear anything about mine, I'll let you know Rightwing. There's a lot of positive comments (only a few negative) regarding the quality of Kahr's factory-repair support. I'd like to have mine back tomorrow. But if it comes back 100% and is a reliable shooter, then I'm satisfied to wait a month or two for the outcome. Reading about other 'pea shooters', I'm confident the Kahr is the best of the lot regarding quality, and accuracy. When they shoot well. Also, among the articles I've read were a couple that discussed the difficulty of making such a small semi-auto, how tolerances have to be just 'so', and there's not much margin for deviation. I suppose some of the issue with the P380's are just general issues with the type (sub-compacxt pistol), and are inherent to the genre. At least...this is what I tell myself. ;-)

Like I said, I'll let you know (in this thread) if I hear anything about mine. Please let us know when you get word on yours.

Alan

[AustinTX]

RW, my P380 also began its precipitous decline after about 275 rounds. Since then, it's been a grab-bag of failures to eject, slide not locking back, slide locking back prematurely, magazines ejected with each shot, brass hitting me in my face, and light primer strikes. It's presently on its fourth vacation to Kahr since April.

The first two trips took just seven and eight days. The third trip, during which they declared my frame dead and replaced it, took three weeks. This time I'm supposed to hear from the Director of CS about my problems, and it has now been 16 days since I sent them my pistol.

[William_the_kid]

Sadly, I have to add myself to the list of folks waiting for their P380 to be repaired. Mine returned to the factory in late June. From round one it displayed virtually every failure mode possible for a semiautomatic pistol. After 300+ rounds and a new recoil spring I sent it back to Kahr. I do love the sights and the controlled recoil. However, I'm regretting my purchase. Hopefully Kahr will turn things around.

[Rightwing]

Great news, over a month after I sent it in, my P380 has finally returned. It mentioned in the enclosed work order that they replaced the ejector, extractor, and cocking cam. Not being an experienced gun person I don't know exactly what that means. I am hoping it equals success when I take it to the range later this week!

[rogerthedodger]

Wow, a whole month! I sure hope it works. Good luck.
Roger

[Rightwing]

Thanks Roger, it was there almost 5 weeks, so I really don't want to go through that again!

[William_the_kid]

Good to hear that, Rightwing. Please let us know how your trip to the range goes.

[rogerthedodger]

Patiently waiting for Rightwing to give a range report.
William the Kid, I too am adding my P380 to the list waiting for repairs. I just sent it in 2 days ago, so 5 weeks from now is end of August. Hopefully, we will all be happy with the results when Kahr returns our "babies".
Roger

[Rightwing]

Ok, I just took my newly repaired P380 to the range. I shot a 100 pack of Winchester White Box. I was in a hurry so I sent these rounds downrange in a hurry. And the results are (drumroll please).... 100% success!! It was like a totally different pistol. Just fire and shoot without any anticipation of a problem. Now, I have had my heart broken before, so I am not going to get too excited until after another few hundred rounds, but so far so good!!!

[wyntrout]

Congratulations! I hope that the pistol keeps shooting like that. I sure love mine and it definitely needed a little help from the factory. I thought I had tinkered with mine to the point I was going to need a new barrel after trying to modify the feed ramp a bit. Watch out with the Dremel Like Tools(DLT)! And diamond bits!:eek: I was able to smooth out the feed ramp after a big :eek: gash! A polishing wheel was just taking too much time! :D

Wynn:)

[HadEmAll]

Ok, I just took my newly repaired P380 to the range. I shot a 100 pack of Winchester White Box. I was in a hurry so I sent these rounds downrange in a hurry. And the results are (drumroll please).... 100% success!! It was like a totally different pistol. Just fire and shoot without any anticipation of a problem. Now, I have had my heart broken before, so I am not going to get too excited until after another few hundred rounds, but so far so good!!!

Sweet. Hope that continues for you.

Mine worked good this morning also. 6 Speer Gold Dot 90 grain JHPs, 3 left-handed, 3 right handed. And 10 (2 X 5) CCI Blazer 95 grain FMJs. This is the first time mine ejected everything nicely out to the right. Not one came back and smacked me. I'm on my 2nd recoil spring pair. It seems to like the new one. I haven't had a problem of any type since I put the new spring pair in.

I was shooting it along with the LCP and BG380. They all worked fine, but the P380 definitely has the nicest trigger of the 3.

[jocko]

just kinna a shame that once back to the factory, what ever they did COULD NOT have been done the FIRST TIME..:banplease:

[rogerthedodger]

YEEEEAAAAA!!!!!!!!!! It's good to hear the success stories, now I AM getting excited, but have to suffer the 5 week wait for mine to return. BAH HUMBUG LOL

[Rightwing]

Great news, another 50 rounds of WWB an 25 rounds of Hornady Critical Defense downrange. The little gun has been very reliable, with 175 rounds of trouble free shooting. My faith in Kahr and the .380 platform is being restored in my mind. I have been very pleased with this gun since returning from the factory. With this consistency I have now cleaned it and placed in my recluse pocket holster for EDC. Yes!

[jocko]

nice report. Hell maybe things are changing to the good for the little gun.

[Bill K]

That is indeed great news. Good for you for hanging in there with your problem child.

I believe that Critical Defense is as good a good choice for a .380 SD round.

[William_the_kid]

Sadly, I have to add myself to the list of folks waiting for their P380 to be repaired. Mine returned to the factory in late June. From round one it displayed virtually every failure mode possible for a semiautomatic pistol. After 300+ rounds and a new recoil spring I sent it back to Kahr. I do love the sights and the controlled recoil. However, I'm regretting my purchase. Hopefully Kahr will turn things around.
Followup. My P380 returned from Kahr last week, after a 3 1/2 week repair. The work sheet says they polished the feed ramp & slide stop, and replaced the ejector and cocking cam. It came back kinda dirty- which I see as a good thing, since it means that they fired more than just a couple of rounds through it. I'll post a followup after I take it to the range.

[mser]

Looking forward to a post repair range report. Mine's been back at Kahr for a week now.

[AustinTX]

My P380 has now been back at Kahr for five weeks (fourth visit). It would be nice if one of these return visits would actually address one of the several problems with the gun, as apparently happens with some other lucky customers on this board.

[Glockenspieler]

My P380 has also been troublesome. Without going into gruesome detail, it had originally proved totally unreliable well after the 200-round break-in (actually over 500 rounds) and a replacement slide stop provided by Kahr.

After over six weeks at Kahr in Worcester MA, It was returned (replaced?) with a new frame and some other new parts. The first 100 rounds fired produced 5 malfunctions, but the subsequent 250 assorted rounds functioned perfectly.

Next, I'll finally try another two boxes of Speer TMJ's. I've chosen this as my carry ammo for the P380 as there's little reason to expect .380 hollow points to expand from such a short barrel, and such expansion would only decrease needed penetration. If those hundred rounds prove reliable, I may consider carrying the P380, that is, if I ever find I can't carry a .38 snub, Glock 27 or Glock 23.

[Glockenspieler]

...but do not construe my previous post as any kind of endorsement. In fact, I will be cautioning my personal and professional contacts against this weapon for now. It may indeed be a great design, but my experience shows that it is severely lacking in execution, and I am far from alone in this experience. If Kahr ever achieves consistant quality control, their P380 will have my endorsement.

I've always fired a few hundred rounds through any weapon before I depend upon it, but only to confirm reliability, not to finish its construction. Regardless of all the excuses its groupies may make, no quality defensive weapon, especially such a relatively expensive one, should require such babying.

[bb46]

...but do not construe my previous post as any kind of endorsement. In fact, I will be cautioning my personal and professional contacts against this weapon for now. It may indeed be a great design, but my experience shows that it is severely lacking in execution, and I am far from alone in this experience. If Kahr ever achieves consistant quality control, their P380 will have my endorsement.

I've always fired a few hundred rounds through any weapon before I depend upon it, but only to confirm reliability, not to finish its construction. Regardless of all the excuses its groupies may make, no quality defensive weapon, especially such a relatively expensive one, should require such babying.
I agree 100% I have been in military and civilian law enforcement for 40 years and the P380 is the worst one for reliability I've owned or shot. I brought mine to replace my 1st gen .32 keltec for more power with some of the new .380 HP loads. None of the HPs worked and when I finally found one hardball load that seemed to work fair the rear sight fell off. This is a $600 + $150 (ammo) handgun that should have been recalled or taken off the market untill fixed. Glad I did't trade in my .32 Not as accurate or as powerful but it works

[Iron Worker]

Bought CW.40 Monday the 7/25,sent it back Friday 7/29. After 200 rnds jammed every magazine a few times from 1st round up till 200th. We all got to face it these guns are actually expensive Saturday night specials. My Sig Sauer P-229 jammed one time 18 years of extensive use. ( That was after 500 rnds with out cleaning) Was going to buy a S&W M&P.40 but was nearly as fat as my Sig .

[Jackalope33b]

Guess you got one of the guns that needed a little extra attention? I got my P380 a little over 2 weeks ago. The first 200 rounds, there were a few FTE, FTF. But after changing to Militec lube, its been flawless for the last 200 or so rounds.. I was using an oil that came with my Benelli M4, and it was like water. But the Militec is so much thicker, and I have had no issues since then. I would carry this P380 at a CCW and rely on it.




I agree 100% I have been in military and civilian law enforcement for 40 years and the P380 is the worst one for reliability I've owned or shot. I brought mine to replace my 1st gen .32 keltec for more power with some of the new .380 HP loads. None of the HPs worked and when I finally found one hardball load that seemed to work fair the rear sight fell off. This is a $600 + $150 (ammo) handgun that should have been recalled or taken off the market untill fixed. Glad I did't trade in my .32 Not as accurate or as powerful but it works

[TominCA]

I had a lot of trouble with my P380 - and quite frankly it was more than you should expect. But in the end it turned out to be a great little gun. It is just so small that it needs a lot of tweaking before shipment and Kahr is having trouble doing that. They really need to pay more attention to these - they can't just fire a few rounds out of the P380 and ship it expecting it to "wear in" in a few more rounds like their other guns do. I had to send it back once, change the recoil springs, polish the slide and barrel, trim the mag follower (in one mag), shorten the extractor pin spring (too much ectractor tension - way more that the PM9 or Mk9), change lubricant, and learn to shoot a 10 ounce gun.

I also own a PM9 and an MK9, both of which never had a problem. The PM9 has never failed to function from day one and the MK9 had a 75 round break in and has run 100% since then. This is what we expect from Kahr.

So what do you get for your trouble? A pistol that gets lost in your pocket, is much more acurrate than it should be for its small size, has a beautiful trigger, will handle all types of ammo and will last for thousands and thousands and thousands of rounds. That should be worth a little effort.

[Glockenspieler]

As an update to those who have been breathlessly awaiting a progress report on the testing of my replacement P380, another 100 rounds of my preferred Speer Lawman TMJ have been successfully fired, totaling just over 200 consecutive malfunction-free shots with this particular load, following about 150 trouble-free shots of various FMJ and HP rounds. So my particular P380 is probably as reliable as any P380, and will consider carrying it, if I cannot manage concealing a .38 Special snub, or something larger.

However, due to the numerous malfunctions (with FMJ) during the first hundred rounds fired, and the 550 rounds wasted on the original frame, I hesitate to give my P380 an unqualified endorsement, and will have to similarly extensively test any other load, FMJ or HP, I may consider in the future.

I will caution friends and colleagues to be prepared to drop a couple of C-notes on test ammunition, and even more should they happen to acquire another of the similarly defective frames still out there (I haven’t heard of any recalls). I believe this piece is potentially far superior to the Ruger LCP or S&W Bodyguard .380 et. al., and someday could well prove to be worth its premium price, but not with its current issues.

[Rightwing]

I understand the frustration as much as anyone. I was not a happy camper spending $600k plus a few hundred on ammo, not to mention a five week vacation at the factory to be repaired. Once it came back, it has been flawless. I do not understand why they could not send mine out right the first time. With that being said, I could not imagine a better pocket pistol than the P380 in my back pocket.

[Barth]

Bought CW.40 Monday the 7/25,sent it back Friday 7/29. After 200 rnds jammed every magazine a few times from 1st round up till 200th. We all got to face it these guns are actually expensive Saturday night specials. My Sig Sauer P-229 jammed one time 18 years of extensive use. ( That was after 500 rnds with out cleaning) Was going to buy a S&W M&P.40 but was nearly as fat as my Sig .

I have a P239/357 that's totally flat, accurate as a laser and has never failed.
It just has a 3.6 inch barrel, and a full grip, making pocket carry problematic.
I can do it on large cargo/tactical pants, but not everything.

If Sig would make a P239/357 micro with a 3" barrel, and two finger grip, I'd be all over it.
Until then my MK40 Elite Micro has come to the rescue. So far it's been totally reliable and very accurate.
Plus it's got to be one of the flattest 40s around.

[William_the_kid]

Followup. My P380 returned from Kahr last week, after a 3 1/2 week repair. The work sheet says they polished the feed ramp & slide stop, and replaced the ejector and cocking cam. It came back kinda dirty- which I see as a good thing, since it means that they fired more than just a couple of rounds through it. I'll post a followup after I take it to the range.

Followup- I finally got my P380 to the range. The first 50 rounds of Winchester White Box were flawless. Then came 25 rounds of Hornady Critical Defense FTX. With the Hornady, I had two instances where the slide locked back prematurely. Then, 12 rounds of Remington Golden Saber, with 2 failures to return to battery. Then I tried 50 more rounds of Winchester White box, and saw 4 failures to return to battery and 1 instance of the slide locking back prematurely. By then the gun was getting pretty dirty, and I decided to call it quits.

What do y'all think? I was sure excited when the first 50 rounds went so smoothly, but dismayed when I started to see problems after that. What would you do?...

[Cokeman]

:cool:

[mudman]

First off hello to all...I am new here. I may be able to say a few things to help....what i do know is the p380 is basically like a p45 but shrunken down to a very high degree. Meaning that with that many moving parts and being that tight then a simple problem may not be so simple due to the idea that there is very little space to allow for a failure, thus a problem that may seem like a weak recoil spring may be something completely different. My p380 has gone back multiple times and I consider myself to be somewhat impatient so I have called quite a few times to check on the status, a while ago it was stated it was on queue however after a few more calls I realized that the customer service was very informative as to the nature of the problem, simply put I was told that considering they have fixed a few and the same problem keeps happening with a small batch that was made they have decided to take a real good look through to ensure ALL parts and pieces are functioning as they should...I was then told about a week later that they may have found the main problem that is causing all the others and are now currently testing to ensure that they have found the culprit to the problem and doing everything in their power to ensure when it comes back to me it will be perfected....thus ensuring the problem will not come back. Lets face it....I would rather them take more time and go through everything with a fine tooth comb to ensure integrity rather than me having to send it back for a third time. I know it stinks to have to wait but the fact is I want it to work properly from here on out.....and in order for this to happen the cause of the problem needs to be fixed, on a gun so damn small its not easy to find the true nature of the beast. I know that even with the knowledge i do have that i would not be able to take this thing apart in entirety and put it all back together perfectly....however i know they can and with what their customer service has told me they are going over some big hurdles to ensure this problem is taken care of.

[JFootin]

That's encouraging! The P380 is the most beautiful of the 380s IMO. I am going to wait until they get all of the wrinkles ironed out, and they release a CM380 as successfully as they have the CM9 ;), and then I'll get one.

[Jackalope33b]

Have you guys done the KARH PREP prior to taking your guns to the range? There is a nice article on this site on how to "break" in your gun before putting any bullets down range..

[Kenjs2]

I received my P380 back from it's second trip home where they "replaced slide, slide stop, recoil spring. Lubed test fired good."
After 2 trips to the range I'm experiencing an all new problem which I'm calling a "striker jam". I'm going to try to attach a picture of what it looks like. I hope you can see that the striker is protuding out of the breech plate. Here is what I've found: if I pull the trigger and lock open the slide the striker is protuding past the breech plate by at least 1/32" (or should I say it never fully returns or moves back?) and it has moved past the striker block. If I turn the pistol upside down and look under the rear of the opened slide I can move the striker back and I can hear it click back into a "blocked" position. If I don't pull the trigger and lock open the slide the striker stays back behind the breech plate. So every last round out of a mag that locks the slide back results in the next round being pushed out of the mag and catching on the bottom of the protuding striker. I have cycled the pistol by hand and almost every time you pull the trigger first you will get this jam on the next round.

The pistol was cleaned upon arrival, after 26 rounds of PMC and again after 24 rounds of WWB. I use NAPA's electronic contact cleaner through both the side hole and the hole in the breech and move the striker back and forth as I'm spraying. Then I blow it all out with an airgun.
I'm ready to send it back for the third time, any suggestions?

Thanks,
Ken

[jocko]

how about taking the striker channel apart. something is freezing i tup in there. There is a photo tutorial on the kahr tech secion. It is not difficult and might just same alot of time going back to kahr.

[Kenjs2]

The striker slides very freely with my fingernail but I'll sure try that first.
I'll let you know.

Thanks Jocko

[Kenjs2]

I disassembled the slide and found very little. No dirt or brass particles. There was some oil in the channel which I cleaned out with contact cleaner and the bore of the channel that the striker assembly slides in was a little rougher than I expected. (I have no idea what the tolerance on the microfinish is) When i reassembled the slide the striker assembly would easily slide back and forth by just tipping the slide, it couldn't be any freer. Relubed the whole pistol and reassembled it and on the first trigger pull I had the same problem. What's the difference between the action of the striker assembly and the striker block when firing a full mag and when you start from a locked slide after firing the last round (or for that matter any slide lock)? When the slide is locked back after firing and the striker is protuding out of the breech hole the striker is past (forward of) the striker block. See photo in last post. Does this mean anything? With all my other problems this never happened until they replaced the slide.

Thanks for your help.