New CM9 Recoil Assembly

[zhills]

I just recieved my new Recoil spring assembly in the mail From Kahr.
I went to napa, they did not have the Locktight brand just
the Permatex Thread Locker in red high strength. I am planing on
removing the end cap from the new recoil assembly and installing on the older assembly, and saving the new springs and guiderod and metal flange. after cleaning the guiderod threads completly and applying
the red Permatex, than tighting it down on the old assembly.

Any suggestions on this procedure. I was going to use a rag in the jaws of a vice or vise grips to hold the big flared end of the guiderod, than compress the spring and metal flange down past the threads of the guiderod. and than use a rag in a pair of hemostats to hold the compression while I apply the permatex red thread locker, and than tighten.

Should I leave the spring and flange compressed for the 24 hour drying time of the permatex? or would it be ok to let the spring and flange pressure sit against the stainless nut while drying for the 24 hours?

Carl

[DJK11]

This is how I hold the assembly.

[deadhead1971]

I will also be messin' with a similar project---to replace out the inner spring. I have bought outer recoil springs from Wolf, and they also send the inner spring too.

I heard you have to apply heat (hair dryer, flame thrower..etc) to the cap to loosen the loctite to be able to remove it. Putting it back on you would not need heat.

I am going to buy a cheap vice. I guess you get plyers and unscrew the cap off?

My Kimber also has the same thing--a dual recoil spring assembly with an inner secured by a cap. The Kimber's design is better because the screw-off cap is on the inside of the slide, not the outside like the Kahr. My Kahr cap has flown off while shooting. At an indoor range, the cap was lost.

[wyntrout]

You can just install the assembly in the pistol after cleaning the nut and front end threads. Lock the slide back and use pliers with some of that anti-slip material or rubbery shelf liner to hold the rod and another pair to grip the nut to tighten the nut after applying the red thread sealant. The threaded area is pretty short.
You can let the joint dry with the slide locked back, or put something... pencil, or whatever in the ejection port to lessen the compression on the recoil spring but leave the nut without any pressure on it while it dries.

Wynn:)

[TucsonMTB]

I just recieved my new Recoil spring assembly in the mail From Kahr. . . . I am planing on removing the end cap from the new recoil assembly and installing on the older assembly, and saving the new springs and guiderod and metal flange . . .
Forgive me for being rude but, why would you want to mess up the new assembly by scavenging for a nut?

If you just want to mess around, wouldn't it make more sense to buy a replacement stainless nut at the hardware store and grind it to shape? That would allow you to keep the good, new assembly intact so that you have something reliable to fall back on if your cobbled up assembly fails.

Feel free to send a raspberry in reply if I am missing the point. My wife will tell you that happens often. :rolleyes:

[wyntrout]

Really! That's a "permanent" joint and you shouldn't break it apart to make your own!

When my end nut went flying the first range trip after I got the gun back from Kahr, I emailed them with a picture and had a new assembly in a few days. I used the old outer spring (very new) with the new assembly and made a replacement nut for the old assembly, giving me a spare and a new outer recoil spring spare.
This makes more sense.

Here's the link to my experience:

http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=3934

Wynn:)

[TucsonMTB]

Here's the link to my experience: http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=3934

Wynn:)
Thanks for posting the link, Wynn. Could use some larger pictures, but that's exactly what I was thinking. :D

[Bear549]

Another thing to note that Permatex is a Loctite brand name. Red is the hardest or strongest grade and does sometimes need heat to loosen especially since this is a round nut and not much to lock onto.

[wyntrout]

I replaced the pictures with original 640x480 pictures on Photobucket. I usually use the lower resolution of 640by480 on my camera to match the resolution for the KahrTalk Attachment Manager, but that thing has been further reducing the images by about 80% instead of the 97.7KB supposedly allowed... since a software change or something around the turn of the year. 97.7 KB WOULD be enough, but not 13 to 20 KB of that!

http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?p=37717#post37717

Here's some Permatex info:

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m620/wyntrout/Permatex%20Info/PermatexInfoLarger_0480.jpg

and

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m620/wyntrout/Permatex%20Info/Permatex2_0478.jpg

NOTE that it's NOT Recommended for use on plastic. The bond is stronger than the plastic, and the plastic will give way before the bond!:eek:


Wynn:)

[TucsonMTB]

Outstanding, Wynn! The picture showing the nut in transition is especially helpful, I believe. :)

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m620/wyntrout/Kahr%20Recoil%20Spring%20Assembly%20Nut/IMG_0475.jpg

[zhills]

Really! That's a "permanent" joint and you shouldn't break it apart to make your own!

When my end nut went flying the first range trip after I got the gun back from Kahr, I emailed them with a picture and had a new assembly in a few days. I used the old outer spring (very new) with the new assembly and made a replacement nut for the old assembly, giving me a spare and a new outer recoil spring spare.
This makes more sense.

Here's the link to my experience:

http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=3934

Wynn:)

Hi Wynn,

That makes since, I think I will do that instead.
I will take the new assembly to install in the gun, but use my old outer spring, actually new, only 100 rds. on it and install in the CM9. Just worried about losing another stainless end nut. Do you think it might help to put a small amount of the locktight, or Permatex GREEN on top of the nut. and let it penatrate the threads? I am not worried about ever taking it apart, I now have extra springs, but can buy a whole new recoil spring assembly for $23.00 dollars, just don;t want to lose the end nut again???

[Bawanna]

I just check mine periodically between reloads to see if there's any sign of loosening. It seems if they come loose it's early on. If they got a good bond they are fine. If you notice any looseness then go with your locktite soak in idea.

I never would bother replacing the inner spring, only the outer and I've never done that.

[MikeyKahr]

I never would bother replacing the inner spring, only the outer and I've never done that.

Somebody coming clean!? :eek: Glad to have you back in your KahrTalk routine, uncle B. And very glad to hear you got some time off and good family time in. And fishing works too!! May you soon have piles of sawdust in every direction.

[Bawanna]

Somebody coming clean!? :eek: Glad to have you back in your KahrTalk routine, uncle B. And very glad to hear you got some time off and good family time in. And fishing works too!! May you soon have piles of sawdust in every direction.

Thanks, happiness is being covered in sawdust. Well not so much on really hot days but generally happy.
You get anything with handles on it yet so I can make some for you?

Please don't say Sig, those are tough.

[MikeyKahr]

You get anything with handles on it yet so I can make some for you?

Please don't say Sig, those are tough.

Don't worry, no Sig here. As for getting anything with handles yet, yes, I've gotten many since you left on vacation - in my dreams! :cool: Unfortunately none yet. I have one more semester of graduate school to pay for coming up then I should have a bit more freedom to add to the arsenal. Though if I came across an 1894 used in great condition I would have a tough time saying no. I'm still plotting and considering the cost(s) and planning out purchases once the money becomes available. Any low-priced orphans you know of that need a good home and caretaker!? :laser:

[wyntrout]

zhills, that should be okay, I guess. I've put a touch of that stuff on things and it seems to hold pretty well. I'm not sure, though, if adding some to a joint would initially soften the original joint. The green Permatex is a lot stronger than the green Loctite, looking at the disassembly requirements... heat and torque needed to defeat the joint.

After making the first nut fit and using the Permatex, I was going to use the rod to turn a few more screws down, but the joint was so tight... hard to remove, that I just left it alone. If I lose any more of those end nuts, I'll just use my drill chuck and a file to make one fit. If Kahr would sell those things, I'd buy half a dozen. They would probably want a couple of bucks each and shipping for ONE!

Anyhow, that sounds much better... the new plan. I like spare stuff. I'm close to being one of those hoarders!

Oh! The good thing is that the gun will still shoot without the nut... so it can wait until you get a new one, though I wouldn't really want to start a range session like that.

Wynn:D

[zhills]

zhills, that should be okay, I guess. I've put a touch of that stuff on things and it seems to hold pretty well. I'm not sure, though, if adding some to a joint would initially soften the original joint. The green Permatex is a lot stronger than the green Loctite, looking at the disassembly requirements... heat and torque needed to defeat the joint.

After making the first nut fit and using the Permatex, I was going to use the rod to turn a few more screws down, but the joint was so tight... hard to remove, that I just left it alone. If I lose any more of those end nuts, I'll just use my drill chuck and a file to make one fit. If Kahr would sell those things, I'd buy half a dozen. They would probably want a couple of bucks each and shipping for ONE!

Anyhow, that sounds much better... the new plan. I like spare stuff. I'm close to being one of those hoarders!

Oh! The good thing is that the gun will still shoot without the nut... so it can wait until you get a new one, though I wouldn't really want to start a range session like that.

Wynn:D

Thanks Wynn, and others.

I put the older outer spring on the new assembly, as it has already started to take a seat, even after only 100 rds. It was a bit shorter than the new outer spring. lubed and installed in the CM9. I am going to napa today and pick up the permatex Green, as I believe it will penatrate the threads even if the nut is already torched. But I will not apply exept if I notice the new nut coming loose, I am also going to go look for the #6 hex nuts... #6-32 in stainless steel today, hoping ACE hardware may have them? I will make the new end cap nut like you did and put on the old guiderod and old metal flange, with the old inner spring, and the new outer spring than lock tight.
I was going to put the guiderod in my drill press though, and turn on, than use the file and sand paper and emery cloth to finish to shape.

How much of a bevel did you add to the nut were it meets the metal flange?

Also if I ever have to install my home made recoil spring assembly is it ok to put the new outer spring in the gun even though it is a tag bit longer? In my opinion it should seat and get smaller after a box of rounds???
I would not think cutting it to match the older spring would not work, because after it took a seat it would be shorter than the original older spring???

Carl