Bullet Nosedive Solutions?

[JACQUESFAUST]

I don't yet have too much to complain about...I just finished breaking in the gun with the first 200 rounds.

I think I want you to respond with suggestions for after market magazine brands/sources for my PM9 because nosedives against the feed ramp are not acceptable, even in the "breakin period."

Situation is that I had a total of 4 nosedives:
--1st day, shot 102 rounds (all magazines filled with 6 rounds)
-- 92nd (approx.) did a nosedive (2nd in the magazine)
-- 99th (approx.) did a nosedive (3rd in the magazine)
--2nd day, shot 100 rounds
-- same nosedives (in the last approx. 12 rounds)
I've heard about ProMag...are there other aftermarket magazines?

PS. I held the gun well. It is moot whether I racked the slide for the first round (I seldom did). All ammo was Winchester 115gr FMJ white box.

Update 9-22-2011:

Are there "double spring" magazines in the aftermarket and by whom? I ask this because the Wolff mag springs purport to be 5% stronger which sort of sounds nice, but the "extra" strength probably needs to be focused under the nose of the bullet.

[OldLincoln]

ProMag used to sell some Kahr mags but they just didn't work out well. Folks around here say to use only Kahr mags. As for the nose dives, there's a few possibilities to consider.

1. Slide Drag: During break-in there is additional drag on the slide as the metal wears together into a smooth unit. It will slow the slide down imperceptibly and rounds may hang. Some units are worse than others. That's why extra grease is needed in lube area 6 especially.

Your unit may have 200 rounds but need more. Some do some don't. Fell that area 6 on the slide. Is it rough or very smooth? It needs to be very smooth or the gun is not ready yet.

If it is rough, you can polish it a bit with high grit count sand paper (1200-1600) clean it well and rub grease into it. Then feel the front (muzzle end) top edge of the barrel shroud. It should be squared but without a lip or burr sticking up. If it there, remove it carefully without rounding that edge.

2. Sticky Ramp: The offset short feed ramp that allows Kahr to be so compact must be shiny and lubed - even though not on the lube chart. I don't mean sloppy greasy, but rub grease into it and wipe clean with your finger leaving a film. Many here polish the ramp and a lot of feed problems go away.

By the way, same advice for the upper inside edge of the chamber. The round comes off the ramp and hits the top of the chamber to make it's turn into the pipe.

3. Recoil spring: Not usually an issue with new guns, but around 1500 rounds +/- you may start getting nosedives where none before. That's a sign to change the spring.

4. Mag: If the mag spring is weak (again shouldn't be an issue on new gun), it can mess up feeding the round. Some have sanded the followers (look up thread) and have corrected it.

5. Shooter issues: Kahrs are built like a high powered Go-Kart. Very short, snappy, and tough to manage sometimes. The slide action requires a solid grip to allow it to recoil fully open and snap closed. If the whole gun moves too much back in recoil it slows the slide effecting a similar problem as Slide Drag. The slide simply doesn't get to get back and forth as it should.

This is a common issue with those new to Kahr. Even an experienced shooter unfamiliar with them can have issues. You may want to find someone who has one that functions well for him/her and let them shoot yours and you shoot theirs. That's the quickest & easiest way to prove this in or out.

PS: I forgot to mention that some of us have also upgraded recoil & mag springs from Wolf. Wolf supplies Kahr springs and the standard springs usually do the trick but we can't leave things alone. If you go that route make SURE the springs are the correct ones. Not all PM9 & no CM9 strong springs are available depending on the slide type. Read more or ask Jocko.

[jocko]

actully u said if pretty darn well ol lincoln.

[Popeye]

All good points OL
I've often wondered if the pick up rail needed to be smoother and it's pulling the next round foward a bit in the mag when the slide moves foward causing them to nose dive.
Seems like we hear so many times it's the second round and wonder if it's because of the spring pressure in the mag. that causes this in conjunction with the pickup rail as the mag is still quite full? I often wondered also if some owners forget to lube the pick up rail. (#9)

I smoothed my pickup rail out a bit using 2000 grit emery paper. Extreme care must be taken while doing this as the pickup rail is slightly concave. At least it is on my PM9. Just a thought......Popeye

[Thunder71]

Winchester White Box 147gr JHP from Walmart, $20/box of 50.

Solved my problem.

[Tilos]

JF:
Some here have modified the follower with good results, and posted the method here.
I don't have time to search and post a link, but you should be able to find lots of info on the subject.
Tilos

[ripley16]

...are there other aftermarket magazines?

I've had very good performance from the ProMag mags that came with my P9. They definitely solve the nose-dive problem and so far have not yielded any feed or eject problems.

[jocko]

actually popeye, smoothing out that interface bar is not a bad thing, can'thurt a thing, but IMO, that magazine whether we like that or not is more than likely designbed to ove that round a tad forward. I have over 32 K out of my PM9 and it does exactly that as does my K9, also with zero issues. I might be irritatting to some but 99% don't notice it, let along it gives issues. To find other mags like ripley 16 has and to get the same results as he has had is not the norm. some as u know have tightened up the front portion of the mag lips on kahr mags and had some success. IO tend to "not fix what ain't broke".

[GunLuvnLibrl]

The thread about modifying the magazine follower is here: http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=1612

My question is, can I sand down the mag release catch a little so that its not sticking that far through the mag and catching the follower?

[jocko]

I would not for it is so easy to then start to get premature mag release. If uruin the follower, u can just throw in a new one and move on. What would be a "littlej"
might indeed be to much. U can sand more on a follower and basicaly hurt nothing. IMO error on the3 side of caution.

[GunLuvnLibrl]

I would not for it is so easy to then start to get premature mag release. If uruin the follower, u can just throw in a new one and move on. What would be a "littlej"
might indeed be to much. U can sand more on a follower and basicaly hurt nothing. IMO error on the3 side of caution.

Will take your advice on that.

[jocko]

u can do exactly what you want to do with the follower. Many here think that follower should have an opening where it meets that cut oput in the mag tube window, to eliminate any chance of what is happeing to some.

[GunLuvnLibrl]

u can do exactly what you want to do with the follower. Many here think that follower should have an opening where it meets that cut oput in the mag tube window, to eliminate any chance of what is happeing to some.

Yea I did the test with breaking down the mag and running the follower through and sure enough mine catches.