New PM40 Owner for CCW, did I make a mistake?

[Ridiculous]

So I had a Ruger LCP and a Springfield XD9 (service), one was too big for CCW (I'm a small guy) and the other too wild (couldn't hit anything with it). So after about 6 months of online and local research I set my sights on the PM9. Shot one loved it, a local up at the conservation dept. has one raves about it, etc. etc. So yesterday I walked into my local GS and and traded them in towards a new PM9, alas at the last minute I saw the PM40 out of the corner of my eye...

So in the back of my mind I remembered reading how 40 was just "better" for stopping power, etc. and since the price was comparable I did a last minute switch and came home with the PM40...

Unfortunately this weekend will be the first time I can get up to the range with it, and I'll admit never shot a 40 before. I do have a 1911 45 which I love and shoot often, my wife has a featherweight snub 38 (snappy but still ok). But everything I am reading online now is telling me this thing is going to be a nightmare to control, recoil, follow up shots etc.

I don't really have any issues with recoil but I am a small guy, 5.8" 150, did I make a mistake? Should I run up there and swap for the PM9 OR just be a man (hehe) and keep the PM40?

Thanks for all your help and for such a great resource!

[Thunder71]

Love my PM9, can't imagine a better carry gun... I'm sure the PM40 will be just fine, I know some have gotten porting done on them to help manage the recoil - but once you do that you have a blinding fireball at night to deal with should you need it in self defense.

[Bill K]

Welcome to KahrTalk!

Congrats on your new PM40. I've got the PM9 myself so can't speak to your PM40. My guess is that if your not recoil shy as you say then the .40 S&W should not be an issue. I don't know how the PM40 compares to the PM9 for pocket carry so if that is important to you I'd find out before shooting the PM40. The PM9 pocket carries very nicely for me but it is on on the edge and any bigger or heavier it would not be a pocket carry choice for me.

Good luck...

[allglock]

You did just fine! Probably what more PM9 owners "should" have done. For a defense weapon, you definately made the better choice!

[Ridiculous]

Thanks everyone! So I'm thinking now that if I don't at least "try" the PM40 out at the range I might kick myself and always wonder if I go straight to the PM9. I can't imagine I would lose out a ton if I were to flip this at a later date for a gently used PM9.

So I think I'll take her out and shoot this weekend (maybe sooner if I can sneak out for a long lunch :)

So happy to finally have a Kahr! Been drooling over these for a while now, the fit and finish is amazing (especially compared to my LCP always seemed like a toy).

Thanks!

[kahrlover123]

The only mistake U made is going to .40 from 9mm :)
U will have to shout out more doughs for range practice.

Either PM9 or PM40 is a fine piece.

[Ridiculous]

The only mistake U made is going to .40 from 9mm :)
U will have to shout out more doughs for range practice.

Either PM9 or PM40 is a fine piece.

Ugh, yea noticed that when I picked up a couple boxes, $14 for Federal compared to $10-$11 for 9mm.

[allglock]

Ugh, yea noticed that when I picked up a couple boxes, $14 for Federal compared to $10-$11 for 9mm.

It will be worth it! :)

[pm9fan]

I bought my PM9 first but really like the PM 40 better and carry the PM40 on a daily basis. The PM9 has XS Big Dots and the PM40 has standard night sights plus the Crimson Trace laser.

You noted the .40 is a better round for stopping power. My PM40 is extremely accurate, as is the PM9. My confidence is not in bullet but the ability to hit what I need to with either. Practice and familiarity with the gun comes with dry fire practice followed by range time.

My PM40 is as reliable as my PM9 and personally find the PM 40 easy to control.

My choices in holsters are in order of usage 1) Comfort Carry with one extra mag 2) Remora clip less 3) DeSantis Superfly 4) Crossbreed mini tuck but going to winter weather the order will probably reverse.

Expect you will love your PM40 very soon. It's an excellent self defense pistol for pocket carry but disappears in the waist band carry.

[earle8888]

Believe you made the right choice.....PM40 pocket carries Greaaat. There is a small (about 2cents/rnd) premium 40 vs 9. bUT...I think worth it. Pursuant to recoil...in my humble opinion...the flash and crack of the 40 is the issue to get over..the actual felt recoil is secondary....I liken it to a hi-vel 38 vs 357 .

[Joe L]

I have a PM40 and a CM9. The CM9 is more pleasant to shoot but I am actually able to shoot the PM40 quicker and with better accuracy, although I don't really want to shoot more than a box or two of ammo with it at a time. If I only had one for carry it would be the PM40.
Joe

[Popeye]

I'm not big fan of the 40 cal round, so I'd say flip that sucker for the 9mm as soon as you can.

[Mattkcc]

In a real shooting situation there isn't much difference with modern ammo. My old department switched from 9 to 40. I thought great more power to stop bangers, but after a few shootings it became obvious that there was no great difference between the two rounds. If you hit the guy in the the SNC he stops otherwise he runs or keeps fighting. What you do gain in the forty is increased recoil, muzzle flip, slower follow up shots, fewer rounds and timed range scores drop. The problems increase as the size of the gun decreases. If I wanted more then a 9 I would get a 45, I find it's recoil more of a shove then the sharp snap like the forty. I carried a Glock 23 and got very good with it but I never felt it was a step up from the 9.

[dirty_sanchez]

40 is sporty.

My first Kahr was a PM9 with an CTL.

I had it for a few months, a few range outings and loved the thing.....that is until my Mom came to the range and tried it out.

She now has the PM9 and I added a PM40 to the collection and added the CTL to it as well.

I like both but wanted to consolidate calibers. Pretty much all I have readily available is 40.

To the OP, we're both the same height but I outweigh you by about 20#. Front of back pocket of khaki's, Levi's in the front or rear pocket are all carry options.

I think you'll like that PM40. No need to regret getting it.

Dirty

[Rainman48314]

You did just fine! Probably what more PM9 owners "should" have done. For a defense weapon, you definately made the better choice!A bit premature if it turns out he can't hit anything with it or his follow ups all miss.

[dirty_sanchez]

Tucson-

My PM40 reliably eats most everything I've fed it through the years from Walmart white box to the 250 round Remington Yellow box Value packs, etc.

My carry load is the 165gr Gold Dot-which it eats like butta.

The only thing it occasionally doesn't like is my reloads. I push the cases through a redding push-through resizer, then with the 7.3gr of Power Pistol and a 180gr Bayou Bullet w/trunicated cone, I'd say roughly 2 rounds out of each mag needs an easy bump on the back of the slide to nudge it to go into battery.

Sometimes it'll shoot a full mag without a FTRTB, then sometimes I'll have to give it a nudge for a few rounds.

As a point of reference, the loads chrono at the following speed:

Gold Dot 165gr, 1,101 FPS
Gold Dot 180gr, 901 FPS
Hornady XTP 180gr, w/7.7gr Longshot (8gr is max), 1,121 FPS
OAL was 1.125"

Dirty


Gentlemen,

I'd like to hear from my fellow PM40 enthusiasts about JHP ammunition that works reliably for them.

Both of my PM40's seem to be picky eaters when JHP is involved. They are 100% reliable with 40 cal Winchester Ranger 135gr JHP Q4368 ammo. They both choke occasionally on Winchester Ranger 180 gr Bonded Hollow Point Q4355 ammo, usually three point jams. Winchester Ranger 155gr JHP RA40155HP is a total disaster with the end of the feed ramp impacting the bullets resulting in a failure to feed from the magazine. That is the PM49 cycles but the rounds just sit in the magazine with their noses bashed in.

Needless to say, I have stockpiled these 135 grain rounds and am fast depleting the 155 and 180 grain rounds during range practice, especially action clearing drills. Right now I have a good stash of 135 grain, but someday may have to buy more ammo. :rolleyes:

Thanks for any insight you can share.

[Ridiculous]

Wow thanks for the great responses! I'm sneaking out for a "Lead Lunch" today and will let you all know how it goes when I get back. Got 2 boxes of red Federal and a box of Gold Dot. Cleaned it last night (a bit finicky on getting everything back together properly) yea I know I'm one of "those" guys that actually likes to clean prior to the first shoot. I go back and forth with buddies about that all the time.

Thank you!

[Bawanna]

No shame in getting to know the insides of your gun prior to the first shoot. Just seeing how things look so you'll see anything different if anything goes wrong.

The Proper Prep for your new Kahr thread is testament to that, many have had a much easier and more pleasant first range session because of it.

In this case you are right and your buddies are wrong.

[getsome]

Hi Ridiculous and welcome to KahrTalk....I have a PM40 and like it fine...I pocket carry with it and I'm not a big guy, 5'11" 170 lbs and after buying several name brand pocket holsters I found that an Uncle Mikes nylon job works the best for me...I used a strip of sandpaper tape like you stick on stairs on both sides of the outside of the holster and it always stays in the pocket when drawing the gun and fully covers the trigger...

To answer TucsonMTB my PM40 seems to eat anything I put through it and so far the only problem is when my son shoots it he keeps hitting the mag release but I hold it different and it doesn't happen to me...If your gun likes 135 gn then go with it...I bought a box of 135 gn Winchester Ranger Law Enforcement ammo and use it for carry due to slightly less recoil....Nothing at all wrong with that load as the number one fight stopper of all time is the 125 gn .357 mag hollow point load and the 135 gn .40 is about the same ballistically

This is the 2nd .40 Kahr I have owned, I had a Magna Ported CW40 I liked but it was just too big for pocket carry...The porting job helps with the recoil a bit, also looks cool and doesn't cause a blinding muzzle flash and I may get the PM40 ported when money allows... I traded the CW40 for the PM40 which is just the right size...I can shoot it ok, not great but good enough at SD range to get the job done....There is much debate over 9mm .40 and .45 as to which is best but with todays high performance ammo I don't believe it makes much if any difference at all with a well placed shot...

The PM40 has some bark to it and you know you have shot something and a 50 round box or so is about enough on the hand for me...The real and only reason I chose a .40 cal is ammo availability and I think this is very important...Remember a couple years ago during the ammo shortage, I could always find .40 cal when all the other shelves were totally bare...I never believed that would happen but it did and it may again...

The major ammo manufacturers make lots more .40 cal due to law enforcement use so there should always be some available so the few cents more it costs doesn't bother me at all especially if it's the only thing available...Bottom line is .40 cal is a good caliber...yes 9mm is easier on the hand and I'm a big .45 caliber fan but even if you choose to carry a 900 nitro express magnum hand cannon for SD it doesn't matter if there's no ammo on the shelf for it but it would make a pretty good club...

I hope you keep your new PM40 and I think in time it will grow on you and you won't trade it for anything!!!...Good luck with your decision...:86:

[BrewerGeorge]

I went through just the same decision and ended up with the 9mm. I've a VERY big fan of the .40, but I had reservations about .40 through a 14oz pistol. There is little doubt that the average .40 is better than the average 9mm, but the difference is much less than it was 15 years ago as bullet designs have improved. The slightly smaller size of the pistol and the reduced recoil and most importantly muzzle flash are worth more to me than the potential increase in power.

I have larger Glocks in .40 that I can carry if I can conceal them. The little Kahr is for deep concealment.

[jocko]

i GUESS i AM JUST A 9MM FAN, THE 40 ALTHOUGH POWERFUL FOR ME IN THE pm SIZE is just not a pleasant gun to shoot alot. I would definitely have to port it but even then it would not compare to my PM9 for just plain on range fun. Not that one cannot handle the 40 in a kahr but u gotta admit ur gonna read alot more of 40 cal kahr owners saying is is a handful where as u don't with the 9's. both will do the job they are intended for. I think many 40 cal owners underestimate the 9mm where as us 9mm fans just think it is the cats ass.

[getsome]

I will agree with you Jocko...Nine is fine by me....I just got such a great deal on my slightly used PM40 that I just couldn't pass it up....I will also agree that shooting it more than 50 rounds at a time starts to not be much fun any longer and in a perfect world I would have rather had a PM9 but so it goes.... As for a 9mm not being enough gun I really don't think a BG with a couple of 9mm .40 or .45 in the chest will be asking you what caliber he was shot with cause he will be too busy bleeding....

[jocko]

yup, makes sense, now that is the second person tonight who has made sense, this sh-t has got to stop!!!

[Ridiculous]

I'm back! That was fun! A little snappy to be sure but honestly after trying to deal with the little LCP the last 6-7 months this little guy is muuuuuuuuch better. One of the guys up at the local range carries the MK40 (I think that's it, the all metal version), he came in and shot it as well and said he honestly didn't notice a ton of difference in the recoil with the polymer frame. I shot 150 rounds through it, taking "breaks" to shoot my 45. It's going to take me a little while to get accurate with it, but hey at least I'm on paper! (ahem, barely see below)

I only had one issue and that was my own fault when racking the slide to eject a cartridge I didn't hold back the slide and the bullet got wedged in between the ejector and the flat area right below the firing pin. No biggie and certainly no fault of the PM40.

I did go ahead and purchase one of the Hogue rubber sleeves for it so we will see how much that helps when I go back this weekend. Anyway, super fun little pistol and I think I'll be keeping this one, may as well get used to the 40 and get accurate with it.

Here are my first 5 @ 7 yards (not great but hey I'm learning)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2795940/IMG_1857.jpg

[Bawanna]

Nice report. Glad your happy with it. I've heard folks mention they didn't feel much difference between the PM40 and the MK. Kind of hard to believe but I've heard it enough that there must be some truth to it.

No matter, your happy, we're happy.

[cgff]

Ridiculous,
Glad everything went well at the range, you will enjoy that pm40 with the
hogue grip sleeve I have 1 on my p-40 covert and it makes a bit of a difference takes the nastiness out of the stippled polymer grip. With the grip sleeve on the pistol there may be a little more effort needed to remove it from your pocket

[pm9fan]

Had a Hogue "Baseball" grip and changed it out for the "AGrip". IMHO a better solution for CCW as it does not grab on skin or clothing as the rubber does from Hogue. AGrip has a similar dampening effect on felt recoil and prevents the sharp edges in polymer grip from biting the shooter.

Here's the link for the specifics on AGrip

http://www.brookstactical.com/Pages/whtsagrp.html

[wyntrout]

Four in the hostage and only ONE hit on the Kidnapper!??:eek:

:boink:

Wynn:)

[Ridiculous]

This is the grip I bought:

http://www.getgrip.com/main/overview/handall.html

It's the Jr. model, seems to fit pretty well, another guy there mentioned some sort of tape you could get as well if you don't want the entire "sleeve". I'm pretty excited to go back this weekend and try it out. I was shocked to see that the PM9 was about the same size, for some reason I thought the PM40 was a half inch or so bigger.

Now one other question, the head man at the local gun shop says never to pocket carry, too hard to draw, too many arteries, prone to accident. He said (I'm a lefty) to special order a IWB and carry at around 3-4 o'clock. In my case it would be 8-9 o'clock :)

Do you guys pocket carry (always what I did with my LCP)? I'll post this because heck I'm new and always figure the best way to get to know people is to embarrass myself... When I got my LCP I made my wife watch me walk about the house switching between pants and a Destantis and Uncle Mikes, to see which one printed more. I know she just about walked out but hell I figure I've done that for her with clothes about 50 times ;)

She owes me!

[Bawanna]

Many here pocket carry. There obviously are numerous pocket holsters to choose from.
But it's personal choice. I don't pocket carry probably for the same reason your range guy states. I sit full time and a pocket draw would be cumbersome and it would be quicker to get ketchup out of a bottle.
Many would leave their gun ay home if it weren't for pocket carry so for them I say it's a good thing.
Even if you do pocket carry I'd still invest in a decent belt rig, either IWB or OWB again personal choice.

[Ridiculous]

Four in the hostage and only ONE hit on the Kidnapper!??:eek:

:boink:

Wynn:)

Awww now I KNEW someone was going to say that :)

I can't see the paper very well, need the Hi-Vis but all my local shop has are hostages or zombies :P

[wyntrout]

I can't resist the temptation sometimes. :rolleyes: I hope you enjoy that PM40. My PM9 sure seemed addictive... was waiting on a night-sighted P380, got the used PM9, then the New PM45, then the P380 came and recently I got my first .40, the P40. I couldn't resist the Mag-na-ported one. It was tough buying another caliber of ammo and stocking up, but I'm happy with what I have now.

I settled on the Speer 165-grain Gold Dots for my defense ammo. They shoot the furthest and are 485 ft-lbs Muzzle Energy. I imagine your recoil is a little stouter. I use a bike tire tube on all of my polymer Kahrs... just right... the feel and the price.:D

Wynn:yo:

[jeffe007]

i have not heard of any great reports from owners of the pm40. all guns have "issues", but apparently this pistol really has "issues" like I wouldn't be comfortable with knowing before I bought one. so, i would steer away from it and swap out for the PM9 OR.......the CM9. virtually same pistol sans the better barrel. oh and better looks of course.

[jeffe007]

i have not heard of any great reports from owners of the pm40. all guns have "issues", but apparently this pistol really has "issues" like I wouldn't be comfortable with knowing before I bought one. so, i would steer away from it and swap out for the PM9 OR.......the CM9. virtually same pistol sans the better barrel. oh and better looks of course.

[Joe L]

Ridiculous,
If you want a little more padding in the grip, you can try some racquetball racket grip tape. I got some from Academy and wrapped my PM40 and CM9 grips with it. That and the plastic mag bases and all is well.
http://joelynch.smugmug.com/photos/i-8GZt782/0/M/i-8GZt782-M.jpg

[Joe L]

i have not heard of any great reports from owners of the pm40.

Jeff--There have been some great reports on the PM40 here, I've posted some. Great carry gun, just not an every day range gun. No problems with mine.
Joe

[SBRGuy]

A couple easy tips on pocket carry that should keep it safe and simple.

1) Always use a pocket holster made for the gun you're packin'.

2) Keep your finger away from the damn trigger.

Your gun won't shoot all by iteslf... people who have had "accidents" with pocket or any other "carry", have been poorly (or not at all) trained and have no clue about gun safety.

[Ridiculous]

i have not heard of any great reports from owners of the pm40. all guns have "issues", but apparently this pistol really has "issues" like I wouldn't be comfortable with knowing before I bought one. so, i would steer away from it and swap out for the PM9 OR.......the CM9. virtually same pistol sans the better barrel. oh and better looks of course.

Well I still have a few hundred 9mm rounds so perhaps I should just pickup a PM9 as WELL as the PM40 :)

Don't want to let all that ammo go to waste!

[Bawanna]

Well I still have a few hundred 9mm rounds so perhaps I should just pickup a PM9 as WELL as the PM40 :)

Don't want to let all that ammo go to waste!

That's the spirit Ridiculous. Get em both and then a PM45, might as well cover all the bases. Then we can work on spares and other needs.