Magazine bullet nose dive

[Brent]

I had an minor issue with a round nose diving after the first shot on my P40. I had noticed the large gap between the rounds that increased as more ammo was loaded into the magazine. I remembered reading some info here at KahrTalk about the ridge on the follower and decided to try sanding it forward on the follower so the bullet would not pivot so much. The end result was successful with even slow hand release of the slide resulting in zero nose dives. It would nose dive every time doing this before the mod. I thought I would post a pic showing what I did in case others are having the same issue. Thanks goes out to those who have posted their previous info on magazine issues. I sure do appreciate it. :)

EDIT: Thanks Greg for your post. I knew I had read this info somewhere here, but couldn't remember where until I ran across it again today.
http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=6943

The ammo is Winchester Target/Range 165 GR. Full Metal Jacket
http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y302/BrentRFC/Kahr/mag-mod.jpg

[JFootin]

That's cool, Brent! Now, you need to go back with some really fine sandpaper and polish it. I might see about doing that to my mags.

[Hognutz]

Thanks for sharing that, Brent. The pictures are wonderful.. There is nothing like good graphics, when it comes to showing/explaining a cure for a problem. Mike

[FLBri]

Thanks for the time, Brent, that you have put into additional clarity on this subject. Very clear and concise pics.

[Brent]

That's cool, Brent! Now, you need to go back with some really fine sandpaper and polish it. I might see about doing that to my mags.

The flash on the camera sure makes it look rougher than it is, but I will polish it up some later. http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y302/BrentRFC/Smileys/sthumb.gif

Thanks for the kind words guys. I like pics myself, so I normally try to include them if possible.

[1slinginlead2]

What photo software are you using to show yuor arrows and text? I need something like that for my Mac.

[Brent]

What photo software are you using to show yuor arrows and text? I need something like that for my Mac.

I'm using Adobe Photoshop CS2. It will do way more than I know how to use. Sometimes I have to just google what I want to do with "CS2" included in the search. The arrows and text are fairly simple to do though.

[Quickdraw]

That is very interesting. By doing that you have eliminated the space where the case can tip as the slide pushes on the opposite side of the base while it feeds.

[Richardh]

I would think that it would be critical to maintain the same angle as you sanded. Any tips on how you did that? Thanks.

[Brent]

I would think that it would be critical to maintain the same angle as you sanded. Any tips on how you did that? Thanks.
Not super critical as the angle of the cartridge is maintained by the lips at the top of the magazine. The follower will pivot around some. It must do this because each cartridge when loaded will force the follower to change its angle as it is pushed down into the magazine. Of course you want it as close as possible to the origianl angle as that would require less removal of plastic from the follower. Just find a round object such as a pen, pencil, or dowel that fits the channel of the follower and wrap some sandpaper around it. Then hold it firmly in the channel as you sand. Just do a little at a time, checking where to "ridge" has moved.

[Brent]

That is very interesting. By doing that you have eliminated the space where the case can tip as the slide pushes on the opposite side of the base while it feeds.

Exactly! http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y302/BrentRFC/Smileys/sthumb.gif

[deanp1964]

holy mackerel - top quality post all the way.
great pics and descriptions - thanks for that

[Richardh]

Not super critical as the angle of the cartridge is maintained by the lips at the top of the magazine. The follower will pivot around some. It must do this because each cartridge when loaded will force the follower to change its angle as it is pushed down into the magazine. Of course you want it as close as possible to the origianl angle as that would require less removal of plastic from the follower. Just find a round object such as a pen, pencil, or dowel that fits the channel of the follower and wrap some sandpaper around it. Then hold it firmly in the channel as you sand. Just do a little at a time, checking where to "ridge" has moved.

:)
Great! Thanks.
Richardh

[KahrOwner]

That looks like a possible fix for the same P380 mag problem too. Great post btw - but pathetic that Kahr quality sucks so badly.

It is obviously not just the P380 that has these bad design issues.

How do they get away with it I wonder?

Anyway, I'm buying a SIG P220 Combat today - reliability just oozes from its pores! The Kahr engineers should buy one too and learn how to make pistols.

Bob

[TominCA]

Great photos - makes a difficult topic easy to understand! Thanks

[Brent]

Great photos - makes a difficult topic easy to understand! Thanks

Thanks Tom! I was hoping the pics would make it clearer.

[Brent]

That looks like a possible fix for the same P380 mag problem too. Great post btw

Bob

Thanks Bob! I'm not familiar with the P380, but hope it helps there too.

[KahrOwner]

Hi Brent -

I tried this mag fix this morning and got some very weird results that I am still struggling to understand here.

I took quite a bit off my follower in the end trying to tilt the rounds backward but no matter how much I filed and sanded away the first 4 rounds would still lie in there very tightly (snug together) and then as soon as you would add a 5th round a small gap would immediately develop at the tips.

Then add a 6th round and then the gap is suddenly almost as large as the un-modified magazine. Weird!!

So... I also took apart SIG and Glock magazines (which work perfectly) and tried to compare the differences.

As near as I can tell the Kahr magazine problem seems to be related to the fact that the base of the magazine is at a much shallower angle than top of the magazine at the bullet loading area. Check this out!

So... my theory is that as the magazine fills and the spring tension increases then the bottom rounds eventually line up parallel with the base of the magazine - which is at the WRONG angle compared to the top.

As a result a big gap suddenly develops at the tips of the top two rounds.

I'm trying to think of a solution because if I only put 4 rounds in my 6 round mag then it feeds beautifully! Even 100% manually. (I guess that using only 4 rounds is ONE possible solution).

I'm currently just heading out to the range to do some more experiments - so that I have a plan B I am also taking my SIG X-Five along (at least I can relax with a little shooting if all else fails).

Bob

[Brent]

Without seeing your mag I can't tell what you have going on Bob. Did the ridge move forward where your shell casing isn't tilting on it? I could get all 6 cartridges loaded in a disassembled mag where there was no gap, but as soon as I slipped the follower in and applied spring pressure the cartridges would tilt creating the gap between the 5th and 6th cartridges. The ridge on the follower was causing the cartridges to tilt to the angle at the forward part of the follower/ridge. The lips at the top of the magazine housing would force the top cartridge to that angle, but the second cartridge down on a fully loaded mag would be at the forward follower angle. From what I see it takes a certain amount of spring pressure before it will force the tilting to the front of the follower. That is why you can get the first 3 rounds in with all cartriges touching evenly, but from 4 on they will start to tilt. Mine was definitely tilting to the angle of the front of the follower until I sanded the ridge forward. There is still some tilting, but the point of the second cartridge down is 1/16th" higher which makes a world of difference in how well mine cycles into the chamber. I have tried very hard to make it nose dive by hand racking the slide slowly and it just won't do it.

[TN_Mike]

Hi Brent -

I tried this mag fix this morning and got some very weird results that I am still struggling to understand here.

I took quite a bit off my follower in the end trying to tilt the rounds backward but no matter how much I filed and sanded away the first 4 rounds would still lie in there very tightly (snug together) and then as soon as you would add a 5th round a small gap would immediately develop at the tips.

Then add a 6th round and then the gap is suddenly almost as large as the un-modified magazine. Weird!!

So... I also took apart SIG and Glock magazines (which work perfectly) and tried to compare the differences.

As near as I can tell the Kahr magazine problem seems to be related to the fact that the base of the magazine is at a much shallower angle than top of the magazine at the bullet loading area. Check this out!

So... my theory is that as the magazine fills and the spring tension increases then the bottom rounds eventually line up parallel with the base of the magazine - which is at the WRONG angle compared to the top.

As a result a big gap suddenly develops at the tips of the top two rounds.

I'm trying to think of a solution because if I only put 4 rounds in my 6 round mag then it feeds beautifully! Even 100% manually. (I guess that using only 4 rounds is ONE possible solution).

I'm currently just heading out to the range to do some more experiments - so that I have a plan B I am also taking my SIG X-Five along (at least I can relax with a little shooting if all else fails).

Bob

This was my theory as well.

I love my CW9 I have to tell you. but at the same time, with this going on I am having a problem trusting it 100%. I've shot it at the range quite a bit but, that's loading the mags and then firing them. I have found that as I carry the mags with me through the day, the top round will start to wiggle forward a bit (spare mag) until is is almost to pop out of the mag. If I drop the mag in the gun after carrying all day, I find that the top round in that mag has also shifted forward a bit. This makes me wonder how reliable that send round I have cycle into the chamber might be in a situation when I really need that gun to work.

Honestly, I am thinking of trading my CW9 in on a Glock 26 at this point and I really am not a huge Glock fan but, I KNOW it will work.

I'm a little disappointed in Kahr because of this. They build such a great gun and then somehow screw up the magazines.

[Thunder71]

Mike, has your CW9 ever failed you?

Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk

[gb6491]

This was my theory as well.

I love my CW9 I have to tell you. but at the same time, with this going on I am having a problem trusting it 100%. I've shot it at the range quite a bit but, that's loading the mags and then firing them. I have found that as I carry the mags with me through the day, the top round will start to wiggle forward a bit (spare mag) until is is almost to pop out of the mag. If I drop the mag in the gun after carrying all day, I find that the top round in that mag has also shifted forward a bit. This makes me wonder how reliable that send round I have cycle into the chamber might be in a situation when I really need that gun to work.

Honestly, I am thinking of trading my CW9 in on a Glock 26 at this point and I really am not a huge Glock fan but, I KNOW it will work.

I'm a little disappointed in Kahr because of this. They build such a great gun and then somehow screw up the magazines.
TN_Mike,
I'll not try to dissuade you from a G26. It's an excellent, albeit fat, pistol. I have a G27 that's been stellar for me and it used to be my carry gun. Now, I carry one of my Kahrs and have faith in them to work when I need them to.

I'd would like to address a couple of things from your post.
One is about "If I drop the mag in the gun after carrying all day, I find that the top round in that mag has also shifted forward a bit." I've seen this in my Kahrs and other pistols that use a single stack magazine (not so common in double stackers). I've also never seen it cause a problem. The round does not work itself forward during the day, but moves when the round above it chambers. To put you mind at ease, you could drop drop the mag after you chamber a round and push the round back further into the magazine.

Second, about the "...as I carry the mags with me through the day, the top round will start to wiggle forward a bit (spare mag) until is is almost to pop out of the mag." I did a follower mod similar to the one in this thread about six months ago and have not lost a round from a magazine since then. A good part of that time, I carried a spare magazine in my pocket without issue. I have since moved on to pouch carry (again without issue) and find it superior in every way (outside the small inconvenience of attaching a mag pouch to belt or waistband) to pocket carry: magazines stay cleaner, are always oriented properly, less likely to be damaged, more easily accessed, etc. You might want to give it a shot.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

BTW, a G26/27 magazine in your pocket will make the ladies think you are glad to see them (well at least partially glad).:)

Regards,
Greg

[jimsea]

sanding the follower as described in this thread was an excellent mod.

my CM9 would hand rack before the mod but it it was not smooth. hand racking is smooth after the mod. Thanks for the thread........great info.

[Brent]

sanding the follower as described in this thread was an excellent mod.

my CM9 would hand rack before the mod but it it was not smooth. hand racking is smooth after the mod. Thanks for the thread........great info.

Your welcome. Glad it helped yours as well. http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y302/BrentRFC/Smileys/sthumb.gif

[Tilos]

It seems to me the ammo in the mag "Fans Out" on the bullet end when the cases are all lined up on the primer end:typing:.

By lengthening the follower contact area, the ammo cannot fan out towards the bottom of the stack as much, and pushes the "stack fan out" more towards the mag lips:001_huh:.

just thinkin'
Tilos

[jimsea]

After reading this and Greg's thread I decided to take an extra 9mm Kahr follower I had and sand it at an angle to raise the nose of the bottom round so as eliminate or reduce as much a possible the "fanning" effect inside the mag tube. I took it down nearly to the line/seam on the back of the follower which is visible in the first pic.

After doing this, you can hand rack the slide as slow as you like and because of the modified follower which changes the angle/orientation of the rounds in the mag, the first round is prevented from nose diving and will come off the mag lips and enter the ramp/barrel smoothly. This worked for me with a CM9.

Results may vary. FWIW no animals were harmed during this mod. :cool:

[Tilos]

jimsea:
Fan'tastic, I thought I'd get a lot of huh:001_huh: type question about my "fan" post.
It's good to hear about your success.

Another thing I noticed about the sandpaper/pencil mod is the radius it forms is smaller than that of a 9mm case.
The case rides up out of this radius on the sides of the follower, directly under the mag lips.
This is, as mine was stock (smaller radius) and wonder if matching the radius to the 9mm case would get even better function.

I guess if I do this and it's worse I'm only out $6 plus shipping.
jimsea...why not try it:D:cheer2:.
Tilos

[Lobo_79]

What photo software are you using to show yuor arrows and text? I need something like that for my Mac.

Google Inkscape for the Mac and you'll get a great open source graphics tool for free.

[jocko]

TN_Mike,
I'll not try to dissuade you from a G26. It's an excellent, albeit fat, pistol. I have a G27 that's been stellar for me and it used to be my carry gun. Now, I carry one of my Kahrs and have faith in them to work when I need them to.

I'd would like to address a couple of things from your post.
One is about "If I drop the mag in the gun after carrying all day, I find that the top round in that mag has also shifted forward a bit." I've seen this in my Kahrs and other pistols that use a single stack magazine (not so common in double stackers). I've also never seen it cause a problem. The round does not work itself forward during the day, but moves when the round above it chambers. To put you mind at ease, you could drop drop the mag after you chamber a round and push the round back further into the magazine.

Second, about the "...as I carry the mags with me through the day, the top round will start to wiggle forward a bit (spare mag) until is is almost to pop out of the mag." I did a follower mod similar to the one in this thread about six months ago and have not lost a round from a magazine since then. A good part of that time, I carried a spare magazine in my pocket without issue. I have since moved on to pouch carry (again without issue) and find it superior in every way (outside the small inconvenience of attaching a mag pouch to belt or waistband) to pocket carry: magazines stay cleaner, are always oriented properly, less likely to be damaged, more easily accessed, etc. You might want to give it a shot.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

BTW, a G26/27 magazine in your pocket will make the ladies think you are glad to see them (well at least partially glad).:)

Regards,
Greg

salami in ones pocket trumps a G26 magazine all day, if u know what I mean.

[cpham9006]

The mag for my CM9 is doing just that showed in the pictures. When loading the mag, on the 5th and 6th round it starts to have a huge gap between the previous round! Do I really have to sand down my mag or can I get Kahr to send me a replacement?

[MLESa7990]

mine do the same thing. I haven't sanded anything and have not had a single issue with 6 round magazines in over 300 rounds. In fact I only had 2 ftf's with my seven round mags even

[Brent]

The mag for my CM9 is doing just that showed in the pictures. When loading the mag, on the 5th and 6th round it starts to have a huge gap between the previous round! Do I really have to sand down my mag or can I get Kahr to send me a replacement?

The replacement would be the same. IMO, if you're not having any nose dive problems then don't mess with it. If you are, then the mod could help.

[Cokeman]

Which mags have the angled follower?

[claycooper]

After reading this and Greg's thread I decided to take an extra 9mm Kahr follower I had and sand it at an angle to raise the nose of the bottom round so as eliminate or reduce as much a possible the "fanning" effect inside the mag tube. I took it down nearly to the line/seam on the back of the follower which is visible in the first pic.

After doing this, you can hand rack the slide as slow as you like and because of the modified follower which changes the angle/orientation of the rounds in the mag, the first round is prevented from nose diving and will come off the mag lips and enter the ramp/barrel smoothly. This worked for me with a CM9.

Results may vary. FWIW no animals were harmed during this mod. :cool:
Jimsea - I just tried sanding down my follower at a sharp angle like yours and now I can rack it as slow as I want to by hand and it feeds perfectly every time. Bravo!

[Brent]

Jimsea - I just tried sanding down my follower at a sharp angle like yours and now I can rack it as slow as I want to by hand and it feeds perfectly every time. Bravo!

Is yours a 9mm Clay? I didn't need to remove as much on my 40 to get the same results. Just wondering what the difference is??? Thanks!

[jocko]

thats why we casll Gregg GB6491 or forum genius

[flccw45]

What, no comment from jocko on this? He's probably busy sanding his magazines.:p

[jocko]

mine do the same thing. I haven't sanded anything and have not had a single issue with 6 round magazines in over 300 rounds. In fact I only had 2 ftf's with my seven round mags even

IMO if IS NOT BROKE CERTAINLY DON'T FIX IT. No mods are necessary if all is working as it should. If ur getting perfect feeding and for some reason u don't like the way that top round looks in the magazine, then one travels (mods) at his own risk. Alot of these fixes on this forum are for people who have distinct issues,, at least from my point of view. Not all mods will work in every gun:der:

If u have issues, readof some of the stated possaqble fixes, Then IMO read um again before doing anything. Follower mods are a no brainer IMO, for at best u can suceed in what your wanting to do, at the worst you have only ruined a $5 follower which is totally replaceable. When u start fokking with the internals of a kahr, then u are entering kahrs warranty territory, TREAD LIGHTLY.:eek:

[Pogi]

Hi everybody!

gb6491: Lookin at your pics, if I'm not wrong your mod is a second mod, the first will be the Chambering the first round, slingshot mod. I saw your YouTube video, so in that video which mod or mods are you relating to?

Nice vid!

Peter

[Krusty]

Thanks for the wonderful graphics, very useful!

[gb6491]

Hi everybody!

gb6491: Lookin at your pics, if I'm not wrong your mod is a second mod, the first will be the Chambering the first round, slingshot mod. I saw your YouTube video, so in that video which mod or mods are you relating to?

Nice vid!

Peter
Peter,
Thanks! My videos about modified CW9 followers pertain to this thread:
http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=6943. Brent's mod is quite similar to what I did, so the videos would apply here in this thread as well. Hope that helps.
Regards,
Greg

[Pogi]

Hi Jimsea! Looking at this image, it seems like there are TWO MODIFICATIONS involved here.
The FIRST one being the slingshot mod by Greg AKA gb6491, note mark "B"
http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/7792/img1082on.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/560/img1082on.jpg/)
Mod 2 = mark "A"


Here are other images of mod 1 as they appear under the slingshot thread
http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/434/magmod.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/818/magmod.jpg/) http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/1916/mod1f.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/840/mod1f.jpg/)
[/URL]


The SECOND mod will have to be the nosedive mod which is the subject of post #26. Here is another image if it might help.
[URL="http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/706/mod12n.jpg/"]http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/8525/mod12n.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/840/mod1f.jpg/)



Are my observations correct?


I feel we need to get more feedback on this second mod. My PM9 is not with me as I am working overseas, but I am decided to do the slingshot mod when I get hold of my PM9. I'd like to incorporate the second mode too and would be glad to see more validation.


Peter


P.S. I'm sure you guys concerned do not mind my hijacking of your images, right?

[Pogi]

0oops!

Sorry guys, I think I messed up. Please note that on my post before this I was refering to PM9. Just now I noticed that this thread started by Brent is about P40.

I think its the case of apples and oranges again, so my earlier post ought to be considered irrelevant.

Peter

[JFootin]

0oops!

Sorry guys, I think I messed up. Please note that on my post before this I was refering to PM9. Just now I noticed that this thread started by Brent is about P40.

I think its the case of apples and oranges again, so my earlier post ought to be considered irrelevant.

Peter

Welcome newby! :) You can Edit and choose to Delete both posts if you want to.

[TennSCN]

Pogi is correct; the follower shown in post #26 by Jimsea IS taking an additional step. He has cut the rear portion of the follower further down to allow the stack of 9mm a bit more room at the rear of the magazine. I saw this discussion a while back in a "9mm fanning" subject elsewhere on this forum. Jimsea's intent, as I see it, is to keep the noses up as the rounds feed. The theory seems to concern reducing the gap between the top and next round so the lower round further supports the feeding round as it ramps and chambers. The shaving he has done to the follower has certainly reduced that gap (see Post #26, 3rd pic) further than Brent or gb6491 (Greg's) work.

Although this may be most applicable to the 9mm because of the greater case taper (where 40s&w and 45acp cases are much less) I see the condition occur in all caliber magazines and hear of diving rounds in all calibers, so there may be something to learn here. Jimsea has taken the follower mod to a 'deeper' level and though more extreme than I would go, may prove to show the limits of this envelope.

Jimsea, I will be interested to hear how that follower holds up over some time. You have taken considerable 'stock' out of the part and my concern would be how much longevity has been removed. Would you mind keeping us posted regarding round counts or any problems with that follower? Pogi, same for you if you make the same deep cut when you get back stateside.

[Pogi]

JFootin: I think we should let the post stay since I TennSCN has made a comment on it, lest we break the thread.

TennSCN: Please note that this thread started with a P40. The second mod by Jimsea was about an 9mm mag, as I said apples and oranges, I do not want P40 gun owners to get confused as I was.

Jimsea: Your video on YouTube shows you cycling the rounds using the stock follower and then the modded follower. May I ask the kind of mod you are refering to in the video, is it the slingshot mod by Greg, or Brent's rear upper follower mod, or is it both?

Brent: Excuse me, I think I had too much coffee that time but my post #42 was a reply to Jimsea's post #26 as correctly pointed out by TennSCN.

Thanks guys!

Peter

[Tilos]

And the reason, I think, sticky info type threads should be locked and left to stand on the info within.
Can you imagine reading 5-20 pages, looking for the nuggets of wisdom, only to waste your time reading what I'm typing here, when most ALL GOOD info was within the part that made it sticky worthy:eek:
Wait I just posted to a sticky thread:behindsofa:

Sorry for what I typed right there,
I'm an idiot:der:

[TominCA]

Great photos and a good solution! Thanks!

[Brent]

Looks like comcast has chosen to block my emails from the gun websites I visit because I haven't received any notifications of recent posts in this thread.:mad: Email address is changed now and I refuse to use Comcast any more.

Lots of good info has been added since my original post. My P40 has been a really great handgun. I had only a couple of nosedive issues early on, but after the mod to the magazine I've had zero. Hand racking the slide continues to work perfectly no matter how fast or slow I release it. :)

[wyntrout]

Dang! I hope that's not true... I'm thinking of dropping DISH when I get my house re-roofed and going with Comcast Xfinity and 20+ Mbps Internet speeds!:eek:

Wynn:)

[TominCA]

I had comcast at home (TV only) they had really bad service if anything went wrong. We have comcast internet at work - about $139 a month and we get abour 26 megs down and 5 megs up (northern CA). They have been excellent for business service.

I asked them about home service and they said it would be about 5 to 6 megs down (which is good enough for HQNetflix) but I still don't trust them - I'm afraid they will limit bandwidth if you are not watching their stuff. We have Dish Network - and they have been okay - but no internet - I'm waiting - and will probably wait forever - for Verizon to get to my area.

[Brent]

Dang! I hope that's not true... I'm thinking of dropping DISH when I get my house re-roofed and going with Comcast Xfinity and 20+ Mbps Internet speeds!:eek:

Wynn:)

Comcast internet and cable tv is fine, but they have changed something with their email service that doesn't allow me to get notifications from my gun sites I visit. I'm using free gmail for that now and getting the notifications again. :)

[JFootin]

I had Comcasst when I was back in Atlanta. I had subscribed to recieve weather emails twice a day from a local TV station. Worked fine for a few years. Then, they stopped coming. I found out Comcasst was filtering them out. I contacted them, telling them that it was not junk mail but something I subscribed to. Even gave them the IP Address of the source. They informed me that they don't listen to such submissions from customers and that I should have the station's web master contact them and plead the case for his stuff not being junk. As if!!! :mad: I think it is part of the business model for cable companies to try and offer the worst CS that they can, thinking it will somehow keep costs down and improve profits. I am with Charter where I am now because it is an apartment and they don't allow sattelite dishes. Same kind of crapass service as Comcasst. :31:

[Wolffire99]

I want to bring this up with the Kahr guys Friday at the NRA convention to see if this has gotten any attention within the company and if not, hopefully educate them about it a little.

[Cokeman]

Comcast internet and cable tv is fine, but they have changed something with their email service that doesn't allow me to get notifications from my gun sites I visit. I'm using free gmail for that now and getting the notifications again. :)

Yahoo email is great for this.

[diverdown219]

I want to bring this up with the Kahr guys Friday at the NRA convention to see if this has gotten any attention within the company and if not, hopefully educate them about it a little.
Did you get to talk to any representative's from Kahr about the magazine issues?

[Wolffire99]

Did you get to talk to any representative's from Kahr about the magazine issues?

Yes, but it didn't really go anywhere. The two I brought it up with we're both sales reps and I could tell weren't really getting it. They gave me the "kahrs have been extensively tested up to 10,000 rounds" answer. One of them said he'd look into it.

[voyager4520]

I wonder if followers from 1911 magazines of the same caliber would work in Kahr magazines?

[jocko]

Yes, but it didn't really go anywhere. The two I brought it up with we're both sales reps and I could tell weren't really getting it. They gave me the "kahrs have been extensively tested up to 10,000 rounds" answer. One of them said he'd look into it.

I would not expect sales reps to have alot of knowledge about the makngs of kahrs. their job is to sell the product,not diaganose it. they usually are not engineers or anything like that . Some sales reps to,, IMO are just like some cops. IT IS A JOB, no more no less:banplease:

[Genec]

I have been wanting to do that on my cm9 9mm and you have given me the courage and instructionsto do it. Thanks Brent

[david8613]

does everyone have these issues with there mags, or is this just a small amount of people?

[Deano]

does everyone have these issues with there mags, or is this just a small amount of people?

I think it's a significant number of people, and I think it has been more common with the 7 round 9mm mags, although others have had issues too. I had two 7 round cm9 mags that both had this problem in spades. Greg's mod fixed both of them. My stock cm9 6 round mag never had this issue. My stock 6 round CW45 has not had this issue.

[TucsonMTB]

I wonder if followers from 1911 magazines of the same caliber would work in Kahr magazines?
They do with .45 ACP, but not when I tried it with a PM40 magazine. The 1911 magazine well is too much larger front to back than the opening in the grip of a Kahr. As a result, the follower jams between the front and back walls of the Kahr magazine tube. Oh well . . . :rolleyes:

[david8613]

I found a vid on YouTube of a guy who was hammering his mags so they can drop free, but I can't find it anymore anyone know the vid I'm talking about? ps one part of the I didn't like though was he was hammering a loaded mag. lucky no KABOOM!

[voyager4520]

They do with .45 ACP, but not when I tried it with a PM40 magazine. The 1911 magazine well is too much larger front to back than the opening in the grip of a Kahr. As a result, the follower jams between the front and back walls of the Kahr magazine tube. Oh well . . . :rolleyes:
There are 1911 magazines for 1911's made in 9mm and .40. I doubt the whole magazines would work in a Kahr but the followers may work in Kahr magazine tubes.

[TucsonMTB]

There are 1911 magazines for 1911's made in 9mm and .40. I doubt the whole magazines would work in a Kahr but the followers may work in Kahr magazine tubes.
Let us know if you find one that does, please. Here are the three that I have looked at:

http://www.brownells.com/userdocs/products/p_692702000_1.jpg
I started by cutting down a regular 1911 magazine follower. It was too large (front to back) to fit in the Kahr magazine tube and a little wide. Filing it to the proper width and removing material from the front to solve the front to back dimension problem was easy, but it still jammed in the Kahr tube because it does not have a skirt.

http://www.trippresearch.com/PDGImages/folf40.jpg

The Tripp Research follower (pictured above) is metal and has a skirt. But it is too large (front to back) to fit in the Kahr magazine tube. I have one of these in hand but could not find a way to shorten the front to back dimension because of all the folded metal.

http://shopwilsoncombat.com/images/500sfk9-10.JPG
The Wilson Combat 9mm follower is available as a kit with their mag spring and is also too large (front to back). The plastic construction might make it possible to cut it down. But, it doesn't look like it would work any better than the Kahr follower. And, it is still plastic, like the Kahr follower, so probably still breakable by feed ramp impacts. I did not purchase one of these followers, so that's just conjecture. Feel free to try it if you have one in hand.

Hopefully, you will have better luck than I have.