KUDOS to KAHR

[JohnXDm]

Kahr Customer Service is A+++ in my book. I sent the below email to their Customer Service. My PM45 was manufactured in August 2011

There is no notch in the slide between the barrel hole and the guide rod hole. The barrel has started making it's own notch. Several chunks of metal from the sharp, brittle area have broken off and caused the gun to stop out of battery several times. The barrel is difficult to remove. When I removed the small pieces of loose metal from the inside on the return spring and barrel the gun ran fine. My concern is that this will continue to be an issue. I have read numerous Kahrtalk posts about the machined notch. Please provide the machined notch that is supposed to be there.
The Black Diamond finish is very thin. It looks more like a charcoal color and has stailess showing at the front of the slide where it meets the frame. The gun has been out of the box a couple of times and has several areas that appear to have thin or missing Black Diamond finish. I have had the gun less than one week. Thank you for your help.

A short time later I received an email back from Jay.

Good morning. I am sorry you are having an issue with your firearm. I have obtained an RMA number so that you may send it in for service. Your RMA number is: XXXX. Please send the firearm, your magazines, and a brief note detailing your issues to us at your convenience. I will email you a prepaid FedEx label by the end of the business day to this email account.
If you have any other questions please feel free to email or call us at any time.
sincerely,
Jay

I received the FedEx label and sent the gun back to Kahr.

I got my gun back today after 3 weeks. Enclosed paper work says New Slide, New Barrel, Test Fired.

Big difference. Looks Great, much better finish and a Notch on the New Slide. :D

Thank you Jay, Thank you Kahr, Thank you Kahrtalk members for Great information.

[Bill K]

Good to read positives on Kahr's CS.

[Rainman48314]

Kahr Customer Service is A+++ in my book. I sent the below email to their Customer Service. My PM45 was manufactured in August 2011

There is no notch in the slide between the barrel hole and the guide rod hole. The barrel has started making it's own notch. Several chunks of metal from the sharp, brittle area have broken off and caused the gun to stop out of battery several times. The barrel is difficult to remove. When I removed the small pieces of loose metal from the inside on the return spring and barrel the gun ran fine. My concern is that this will continue to be an issue. I have read numerous Kahrtalk posts about the machined notch. Please provide the machined notch that is supposed to be there.
The Black Diamond finish is very thin. It looks more like a charcoal color and has stailess showing at the front of the slide where it meets the frame. The gun has been out of the box a couple of times and has several areas that appear to have thin or missing Black Diamond finish. I have had the gun less than one week. Thank you for your help.

A short time later I received an email back from Jay.

Good morning. I am sorry you are having an issue with your firearm. I have obtained an RMA number so that you may send it in for service. Your RMA number is: XXXX. Please send the firearm, your magazines, and a brief note detailing your issues to us at your convenience. I will email you a prepaid FedEx label by the end of the business day to this email account.
If you have any other questions please feel free to email or call us at any time.
sincerely,
Jay

I received the FedEx label and sent the gun back to Kahr.

I got my gun back today after 3 weeks. Enclosed paper work says New Slide, New Barrel, Test Fired.

Big difference. Looks Great, much better finish and a Notch on the New Slide. :D

Thank you Jay, Thank you Kahr, Thank you Kahrtalk members for Great information.Glad you're happy but many other manufacturers do better than three weeks. What's of more concern is that no QC appears to have occured on this gun. The flaws should have been easily visible.

[OldLincoln]

Welcome to the forum John. Glad things went so well for you.

[deanp1964]

I'm also glad to see that they got you fixed up - kudos on the repair.
The time it takes them is pretty unimpressive in my view.

What would REALLY be cool is if Kahr could manage not to let such a lemon out of their factory and into the hands of the consumer to begin with. That would impress me.

[JFootin]

Rainman and Dean, are there dark little storm clouds just hanging over your heads all the time? Kahr has good quality QC and CS that is second to none. EVERY gun manufacturer has QC slips and guns needing warranty service. But you guys making comments like this on a thread where the OP is sharing his satisfaction with the service he received is just not called for! Both of you just POOPED on his thread! Stop it! Keep your gripes about Kahr in your own threads and stop pooping on everybody else's threads!

[Bawanna]

I was gonna suggest maybe focusing on the last thing you bought that pleased you, be it car, or truck or drill press or whatever and focus on that.
I didn't fall in the pitcher when they mixed the Kahr kool aid but I thought we were through a negative karma phase.

I agree with jfootin on the location of expressing your unhappiness or your lack of being impressed. I'm sure that will be a subject at the next Kahr board meeting. I can see it on the agenda. Dean is not impressed. Thoughts? Idea's? Any one give a rats backside, a show of hands please?

Again constructive, honest, and accurate beefs are open for discussion.

Black clouds floating all over the forum or a broken pipe before the septic tank is not.

[OldLincoln]

Yeah, for those who buy a new $250K house, they hand you a punch list form to list all the things that are wrong with your brand new quarter mill house and will come back in a few weeks and fix them. NOT perfect out of the box.

If you buy a new $100K luxury automobile they will tell you to write down all the stuff you need fixed and bring it in and they will fix it under warranty. NOT perfect out of the box.

If you buy a new $2500 custom handgun you will be told to shoot 200-300 rounds and if there's any problems bring it back for warranty repair. Some NOT perfect out of the box.

The only thing I know that can be bought that is almost always perfect out of the box is a $25 Billion space shuttle and how often have you seen delays on the launch pad for last minute repairs? NOT perfect out of the box, but perhaps better than average.

I was a Crew Chief in the USAF and we picked up brand new KC135's from the Boeing factory at many million a pop. I can assure you they were NEVER perfect out of the box.

So get over it already!!!! (since we're into large fonts in this thread)

[Ubaldo99]

Havent had the need so far to use Kahr CS...which is a positive reflection on the quality of their product. Good to know, however, that Kahr CS is so responsive to customer problems.

[Rainman48314]

Yeah, for those who buy a new $250K house, they hand you a punch list form to list all the things that are wrong with your brand new quarter mill house and will come back in a few weeks and fix them. NOT perfect out of the box.

If you buy a new $100K luxury automobile they will tell you to write down all the stuff you need fixed and bring it in and they will fix it under warranty. NOT perfect out of the box.

If you buy a new $2500 custom handgun you will be told to shoot 200-300 rounds and if there's any problems bring it back for warranty repair. Some NOT perfect out of the box.

The only thing I know that can be bought that is almost always perfect out of the box is a $25 Billion space shuttle and how often have you seen delays on the launch pad for last minute repairs? NOT perfect out of the box, but perhaps better than average.

I was a Crew Chief in the USAF and we picked up brand new KC135's from the Boeing factory at many million a pop. I can assure you they were NEVER perfect out of the box.

So get over it already!!!! (since we're into large fonts in this thread)

I have a different take on this owners experience.The proper analogy on buying a house isn't a punch list. It would be more like a builder forgetting to install the furnance or leaving off the back door. Same for the luxury car. When I picked up my Mercedes E350s, both times they were flawless out of the box. And when I eventually pickup a high end 1911, I fully expect it to have been QC checked or it will result in a similar posting. I think you, and some others, are setting your standards too low. These Kahrs are not Hi-Points or used guns. You are comparing items with tens of thousnads of parts, if not a mlillion parts, to one quite a bit simpler. What's in a Kahr, sixty to 90 parts? Finally, three weeks turn around won't win any J D Power prizes when SIG, HK and Smith do repairs in days.

[Rainman48314]

Rainman and Dean, are there dark little storm clouds just hanging over your heads all the time? Kahr has good quality QC and CS that is second to none. EVERY gun manufacturer has QC slips and guns needing warranty service. But you guys making comments like this on a thread where the OP is sharing his satisfaction with the service he received is just not called for! Both of you just POOPED on his thread! Stop it! Keep your gripes about Kahr in your own threads and stop pooping on everybody else's threads!Sounds like you think a thread promoting an OPINION, should only be greeted by like minded opinions. If you think Quality Control is good, you are dreaming. Further, three week turn around is below average in my experience.

[WMD]

I thought your comment on turn around time was interesting Rainman.

First of all, I think Bawanna was addressing you "raining" on the OP's parade. (sorry for the pun) :D The guy just expressed how pleased he was and you poo pooed it.

Getting back to your comment.... 3 weeks is bad turn around? I agree it is not as good as Kahr used to be (less then a week based upon feedback from this forum, I personally have not needed to send my PM9 back.), but tell me what manufacturer is turning guns around quicker then 3 weeks? S&W is 6 to 7 weeks Taurus is about the same. I could go on. The average I have seen (as a dealer) is about 4 to 6 weeks from all of the manufacturers. The exception is LE guns. Most manufacturers give priority to LE guns and they usually jump to the head of the list.

Now..... it sounds like everything you buy is flawless right out of the box. So how would you know what the other manufacturers turn around times are? Would it be from having to send your guns back for repair? :D

(I may be busting your chops a little bit! ;))

[Rainman48314]

I thought your comment on turn around time was interesting Rainman.

First of all, I think Bawanna was addressing you "raining" on the OP's parade. (sorry for the pun) :D The guy just expressed how pleased he was and you poo pooed it.

Getting back to your comment.... 3 weeks is bad turn around? I agree it is not as good as Kahr used to be (less then a week based upon feedback from this forum, I personally have not needed to send my PM9 back.), but tell me what manufacturer is turning guns around quicker then 3 weeks? S&W is 6 to 7 weeks Taurus is about the same. I could go on. The average I have seen (as a dealer) is about 4 to 6 weeks from all of the manufacturers. The exception is LE guns. Most manufacturers give priority to LE guns and they usually jump to the head of the list.

Now..... it sounds like everything you buy is flawless right out of the box. So how would you know what the other manufacturers turn around times are? Would it be from having to send your guns back for repair? :D

(I may be busting your chops a little bit! ;))I'm not LEO, so my warranty times are not accelerated. Just this year I have purchased new & perfect out of the box:

Beretta Neos
Ruger SR9c
M&P 9
Ruger LC9
GSG 1911-22
M&P 15 5.56 /.223

Used and perfect

HK P30 - unknown round count
Kimber Rimfire Target 17 Mach2 (less than 30 rounds at the time; 350 rounds since)

New but problems

Kahr PM9 - CS mailed me a replacement broken recoil assembly, on rare occasionally has a nosedive with FMJ ammo (not sent back)

Sig P238 (new) - replaced with new gun RT two weeks

Sig P238 (new replacement)- sent for feedramp polish, ten days RT

Others sent to manufacturer for service:

Sig 1911 RCS (bought used) - returned in 7 days RT

HK P7 -(bought used) sent for service 12 days RT

As you can see, there is some personal and recent experience with service turn around behind my post.

[O'Dell]

I have a different take on this owners experience.The proper analogy on buying a house isn't a punch list. It would be more like a builder forgetting to install the furnance or leaving off the back door. Same for the luxury car. When I picked up my Mercedes E350s, both times they were flawless out of the box. And when I eventually pickup a high end 1911, I fully expect it to have been QC checked or it will result in a similar posting. I think you, and some others, are setting your standards too low. These Kahrs are not Hi-Points or used guns. You are comparing items with tens of thousnads of parts, if not a mlillion parts, to one quite a bit simpler. What's in a Kahr, sixty to 90 parts? Finally, three weeks turn around won't win any J D Power prizes when SIG, HK and Smith do repairs in days.

My STI 1911 wouldn't go into battery right out of the box. [after a cleaning and lube] It had to go back for a new barrel and a stronger recoil assy. That took four weeks. That's the only pistol that wasn't 100% in several years including five Kahrs. Also my Porsche certainly wasn't perfect - it required three trips to the dealer to sort out the problems.

[Bawanna]

I sat in a Porsche once.

[MikeyKahr]

jocko's? Was that why he had to have to have it serviced? Did you leave your "mark"?

[Rainman48314]

I sat in a Porsche once.I had an '87 924 and the dealer's mechanic yelled at me for driving it in the winter. It was my only car and seemed a better idea than walking.

[OldLincoln]

I have a different take on this owners experience.The proper analogy on buying a house isn't a punch list. It would be more like a builder forgetting to install the furnance or leaving off the back door. Same for the luxury car. When I picked up my Mercedes E350s, both times they were flawless out of the box. And when I eventually pickup a high end 1911, I fully expect it to have been QC checked or it will result in a similar posting. I think you, and some others, are setting your standards too low. These Kahrs are not Hi-Points or used guns. You are comparing items with tens of thousnads of parts, if not a mlillion parts, to one quite a bit simpler. What's in a Kahr, sixty to 90 parts? Finally, three weeks turn around won't win any J D Power prizes when SIG, HK and Smith do repairs in days.

I have read a lot of posts and have yet to read of someone receiving a new Kahr missing a barrel. My comparison is not bogus but right on. It doesn't matter how many parts something is as price compensates for that. My point is stuff happens and if you can't deal with that perhaps you should start making them yourself. I don't defend Kahr by claiming they are perfect, but neither do I beat this horse to death deriding them for trying to do a great job and missing the mark sometimes.

Same with other companies. You have bought a lot perfect products, but evidently have not ever received one with a fault until now. This one seems to have really upset you to keep ranting on it undercutting others positive experience. I do hope you will come to grips with that and let it go. Get your gun fixed or trade it off. Life is more than guns and Mercedes and I hope yours is all positive.

[deanp1964]

Rainman and Dean, are there dark little storm clouds just hanging over your heads all the time? Kahr has good quality QC and CS that is second to none. EVERY gun manufacturer has QC slips and guns needing warranty service. But you guys making comments like this on a thread where the OP is sharing his satisfaction with the service he received is just not called for! Both of you just POOPED on his thread! Stop it! Keep your gripes about Kahr in your own threads and stop pooping on everybody else's threads!


LOL - yeah, let's all just sing Koomba-Ya and drink purple Kool-Aid too. :banplease:
I was pleased that the OP received good service and was satisfied with Kahr (and said so)
If you read the forum, the quality issues are excessive - its pretty plain to see.
When Kahr makes things right with me you will all know it. My comments are directly related to my current on-going experiences with my PM45 and Kahr customer service. I'm not just raining on everyone's parade here. I'll smile while I type though, just to see if that helps a little.

my last satisfying purchase? I was very pleased with my PM9 and have stated so, over and over again. Also, the Para Carry C6 that I bought in 2006 was a very good handgun. My worst mistake was selling it when I needed $800 real bad.

[Rainman48314]

I have read a lot of posts and have yet to read of someone receiving a new Kahr missing a barrel. My comparison is not bogus but right on. It doesn't matter how many parts something is as price compensates for that. My point is stuff happens and if you can't deal with that perhaps you should start making them yourself. I don't defend Kahr by claiming they are perfect, but neither do I beat this horse to death deriding them for trying to do a great job and missing the mark sometimes.

Same with other companies. You have bought a lot perfect products, but evidently have not ever received one with a fault until now. This one seems to have really upset you to keep ranting on it undercutting others positive experience. I do hope you will come to grips with that and let it go. Get your gun fixed or trade it off. Life is more than guns and Mercedes and I hope yours is all positive.You leave the distinct impression that there can only be one way to think. You say you've read a lot of posts, if so, how did you miss all the complaints about poor QC or poor mag designs etc?

True, the Kahr was not missing a barrel, but, it was missing a notch that should have been machined in and it was missing a visual QC inspection. There have also been posts about brand new Kahrs needing replacement barrels.

You somehow think I am upset. I'm not. I am presenting the other side. Fair and Balanced. I also have not responded or added to two or three DOZEN posts which state complaints about Kahr. Maybe you should read what those owners have to say.

At this price point, expectations need to be set higher than you you've set them.

[WMD]

I have read a lot of posts and have yet to read of someone receiving a new Kahr missing a barrel. My comparison is not bogus but right on. It doesn't matter how many parts something is as price compensates for that. My point is stuff happens and if you can't deal with that perhaps you should start making them yourself. I don't defend Kahr by claiming they are perfect, but neither do I beat this horse to death deriding them for trying to do a great job and missing the mark sometimes.

Same with other companies. You have bought a lot perfect products, but evidently have not ever received one with a fault until now. This one seems to have really upset you to keep ranting on it undercutting others positive experience. I do hope you will come to grips with that and let it go. Get your gun fixed or trade it off. Life is more than guns and Mercedes and I hope yours is all positive.

You are right on OldLincoln. It seems people keep forgetting that you seldom hear of all of the guns shipped that are working with no issues. You hear a few problems and then assume they all are plagued. Rainman sent back a few Sigs for repair. Does that mean Sig makes junk? I do not think so. I have had to send back guns from just about every major manufacturer. I once sent a rifle back to Winchester 3 times and then.... the last time it came back, it had an incorrect part on it. I contacted Winchester, screamed a lot and said, just send me the part, I will fix the gun. That is what they did! Had a similar issue with Rossi (on a very expensive gun)! I could go on..... Anyway, lets get over this and move forward. :D

[Bawanna]

JohnXDm, I'm happy for you dude. I agree with WMD. Let's move forward or I'm pulling the plug.

[deanp1964]

I understand that it can be difficult to see criticism of a product or company that we really value.

The benefit of an open forum however is multiple views and experiences, rather than just one well-managed way of thinking.

I work in a manufacturing field, have now for 28 years. I am plant manager of my company. In our business, ONE bad part out of even 100,000 parts can necessitate the rejection of the ENTIRE shipment. It also entails very complex and involved corrective actions and proof thereof, all targeted at guaranteeing that the customer will not experience the the same defect again. Ever. Additionally, the customer requires immediate replacement of their product. They do not wait around for days, let alone weeks. This is the reality in most manufacturing environments in North America, Europe and Japan today. (China still has the dubious luxury of being the exception - they play by their own rules).

So you can see how I might find it unacceptable when I see repeat quality problems with magazines, machining on slides, poorly polished feed ramps etc.. And when the time-frame is 3 weeks, well, that's just being lackadaisical in my view.

That being said, I still LOVE my PM9 and I can't wait to have a problem-free PM45 (once my issues are resolved by Kahr).

[WMD]

Your in to quality and you ride a Harley????? :D

(from your avatar)

[sfla99]

but tell me what manufacturer is turning guns around quicker then 3 weeks?

I am not jumping into the fray here, but I sent H&K my P2000SK for some sight work (new mepro's), they got it delivered overnight by me, did the work by noon, called me on the phone that same day to let me know the work was completed and then turned around an FedEx overnight the package back to me all in one day lol.

But then again ;)

[Bawanna]

I think it's well worth noting that many many folks here have gotten their guns back for a repair in under a week.

A lot depends on whats wrong with it, possible shortage of a large part, work load.

I know that one of the goals to any manufacturer is to keep the repair time frames to a minimum. I know this to be true at Kahr as well.

From the outside it may be hard for us to understand the logistics of things.

I try not to dwell on the negative. True it needs to be shared and it should be addressed and I think it will be.

Open honest criticism and move on. No need to be a fertilizer spreader on the farm over the whole forum.

And on this happy note I bid this thread adieu.